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  #121  
Old 2 May 2019, 10:38
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"I genuinely thought she was 18...."

"I genuinely thought I was sober..."

It *is* an interesting thought experiment on if any mitigation should be given to walking into the wrong apartment - thinking it was yours. I think sometimes the screw-up is so bad, what you thought doesn't matter. I'd like to see side by side photographs taken from the door - to see how similar the apartments looked.
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  #122  
Old 2 May 2019, 11:32
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Did I say she shouldn't be held accountable? I think there's quite a difference between shooting across the front of your partner from the passenger's seat and killing a woman in her pajamas vs shooting a man who you think is an intruder in your home.
Did I say you said she shouldn't be held accountable?

Personally, I think it's more egregious to enter somebody else's home, thinking it's yours and shoot them dead than to shoot across the front of your partner from the passenger seat and kill a woman in her pajamas who pops up at the window in a dark alley in the middle of the night.

The fact that his apartment door had a distinctive red door mat in front of it that hers didn't makes the fuck-up even huger...
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  #123  
Old 7 June 2019, 15:55
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12.5 years, and a $6,000 fine.

Defense has asked for probation.
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  #124  
Old 7 June 2019, 16:17
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I could never be a defense attorney. Mostly because I hate school but also because I could never say shit like that with a straight face.
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  #125  
Old 7 June 2019, 17:21
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The proposal was that Noor report to the workhouse for a week on the anniversary of the killing and another week on her birthday during the length of his sentence coupled with his community service. That was to be the punishment for the crime he was convicted of. Link follows

https://www.kare11.com/article/news/...b-b1ec7dbcae67

My uninformed opinion, let him rot.
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  #126  
Old 7 June 2019, 17:30
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My uninformed opinion, let him rot.
Why, exactly?
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  #127  
Old 7 June 2019, 17:56
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I still don’t understand how he got convicted of murder and manslaughter.
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  #128  
Old 7 June 2019, 18:12
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From what I have seen on the news it would seem that the only time he, Noor, felt comfortable doing his job was when he had his firearm in his hand. Put him in the dark responding to a call, firearm in hand failure to identify the threat and pulling the trigger with his partner between him and the intended unidentified target. Convicted of the crime he like anyone should do the time. Link

https://www.kare11.com/article/news/...a-4e0fe4f5256d

Uniformed because I am not in Law Enforcement and never have been.
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  #129  
Old 7 June 2019, 18:29
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Originally Posted by Durable View Post
From what I have seen on the news it would seem that the only time he, Noor, felt comfortable doing his job was when he had his firearm in his hand. Put him in the dark responding to a call, firearm in hand failure to identify the threat and pulling the trigger with his partner between him and the intended unidentified target. Convicted of the crime he like anyone should do the time.
What is the average sentence for anyone in MN convicted of those charges?
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  #130  
Old 7 June 2019, 18:33
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Once was said to me "the hardest words you can say is", "I don't know".

Respectfully,

Bob
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  #131  
Old 7 June 2019, 18:45
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Originally Posted by Durable View Post
Once was said to me "the hardest words you can say is", "I don't know".

Respectfully,

Bob
Fair enough.

My thoughts (and just that...my thoughts and suspicions) are that Mr Noor was seized upon as a diversity bean by a police department that wanted to virtue-signal. I suspect that he was probably not a stellar performer during pre-hire screening and testing or at the academy. I suspect that he probably did not perform very well during Field Training, either. In fact, I'm guessing he probably had no business being a cop, but he was just too special to not be a cop, in the view of the politicians of that city.

I don't know the average sentence around that area for a first-time offender with similar chargess. I have a very hard time seeing his actions meeting the elements for Murder. I seriously doubt other first-time offenders would get that amount of time in a manslaughter case that had the same level of intent as an element of the crime. I know that in both states that I was a cop in (CA and AK), only a cop could possibly get a sentence that harsh in similar circs.
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  #132  
Old 7 June 2019, 18:54
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Originally Posted by gavin View Post
Fair enough.

My thoughts (and just that...my thoughts and suspicions) are that Mr Noor was seized upon as a diversity bean by a police department that wanted to virtue-signal. I suspect that he was probably not a stellar performer during pre-hire screening and testing or at the academy. I suspect that he probably did not perform very well during Field Training, either. In fact, I'm guessing he probably had no business being a cop, but he was just too special to not be a cop, in the view of the politicians of that city.
I have two just like this right now. One has already shit the bed and goes to grand jury soon and the other, that one will be any day now. Myself and others have done everything we legally can to bring attention to the failings of this individual to the leadership but to no avail.

“Too special to not be a cop...”
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  #133  
Old 7 June 2019, 19:12
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For the average sentences, Manslaughter 2nd Degree, 5 years, Murder 3rd Degree, 10-15 years. 2/3rds generally served, 17.5 years should be 11.7 years served. This information is for Minnesota. I am but a Mechanic and know nothing of Court or Law Enforcement. From what I have seen and read Gavin and Whitebean54 are spot on.

Respectfully,

Bob
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  #134  
Old 8 June 2019, 05:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
I know that in both states that I was a cop in (CA and AK), only a cop could possibly get a sentence that harsh in similar circs.
Does "Higher Standard of Care" play a part? I always hear it brought up in regards to the use of a firearm in legal presentations.
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On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

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"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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  #135  
Old 8 June 2019, 09:41
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
Does "Higher Standard of Care" play a part? I always hear it brought up in regards to the use of a firearm in legal presentations.
There are all sorts of factors that play into this, but, the biggest is the fact, in my view, that, to quote Hognose, "all prosecutors are politicians in larval form." Prosecutors love going hard at cops, because it makes for great campaign speeches down the road.

There are also "under color of authority" factors, and the role of intent as an element of the crime.
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  #136  
Old 8 June 2019, 12:23
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I see both sides of the issue of whether cops should be held to a higher standard, the same standard, or cut some slack.

It's a tough one because while they wield a lot of authority/power over fellow citizens and we expect (demand?) more from them because of it, they're also, by the very nature of the job that we ask (demand?) of them to do, placed in situations where they have the opportunity to make the mistake in the first place.

As a police officer, I was in fights, chases, etc all the time. I had the opportunity, within the context of rapidly changing and volatile situations, to make the wrong split-second decision at the wrong time. Because it was my job to be in that situation.

As a private citizen, I'm not in those situations. Because that's not my job.

I'm not going to chase a suspect down a dark alley and then mistake a cellphone for a gun...because I'm not going to be chasing a suspect down a dark alley in the first place.

So yeah, it's a tough one and it's kind of hard to grasp if you haven't been there. Wisdom combined with similar experience can substitute for the "been there" part, which is why many here are pretty fair despite having no direct LE experience, but the general public is a different animal. Which is why you usually have two clearly defined camps- the Thin Blue Line/1* camp and the "fuck cops, they should be held accountable just like I would" camp.

Reality is a moving target and takes some wisdom to locate at times, which sadly, is rare these days.
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  #137  
Old 8 June 2019, 12:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KS11 View Post
I see both sides of the issue of whether cops should be held to a higher standard, the same standard, or cut some slack.

It's a tough one because while they wield a lot of authority/power over fellow citizens and we expect (demand?) more from them because of it, they're also, by the very nature of the job that we ask (demand?) of them to do, placed in situations where they have the opportunity to make the mistake in the first place.

As a police officer, I was in fights, chases, etc all the time. I had the opportunity, within the context of rapidly changing and volatile situations, to make the wrong split-second decision at the wrong time. Because it was my job to be in that situation.

As a private citizen, I'm not in those situations. Because that's not my job.

I'm not going to chase a suspect down a dark alley and then mistake a cellphone for a gun...because I'm not going to be chasing a suspect down a dark alley in the first place.

So yeah, it's a tough one and it's kind of hard to grasp if you haven't been there. Wisdom combined with similar experience can substitute for the "been there" part, which is why many here are pretty fair despite having no direct LE experience, but the general public is a different animal. Which is why you usually have two clearly defined camps- the Thin Blue Line/1* camp and the "fuck cops, they should be held accountable just like I would" camp.

Reality is a moving target and takes some wisdom to locate at times, which sadly, is rare these days.
Spot on.
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  #138  
Old 8 June 2019, 12:33
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...your spot on post...
Very well said indeed!
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  #139  
Old 8 June 2019, 13:16
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Steel on target.
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  #140  
Old 8 June 2019, 14:23
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