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  #1  
Old 10 December 2001, 23:43
Enfield Enfield is offline
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The Budget

Comments? I think what we got was just a drop in the bucket - barely enough to start covering what we already have, which isn't nearly enough.
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  #2  
Old 11 December 2001, 01:31
Marauder
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Is anyone else's ass really sore after hearing we didn't even merit $2 billion?

I guess Shawinigan needs a few more hotels and golf courses more badly than we need cash to equip and train properly. Or maybe I'm just starting to get jaded.

[This message has been edited by Marauder (edited 12-10-2001).]
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  #3  
Old 11 December 2001, 03:41
farseer farseer is offline
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Unhappy

i remember hearing a report on the news saying canada needs something like $12 billion just to get the military up to where it should be.

i keep hearing about the increase of the JTF personal to a battalion, should do wonders for recruitment i guess - whats the point of having an elite force if they can't get anywhere?

we can't even brag about our new ships anymore because of the huge backlog of maintainence due on each - no money for upkeep.(small tear rolling down cheek)

i don't know if you guys know of this but its a good site for news on the CF.
http://www.cfc.dnd.ca/spotlight.en.html

i'm just bitter cause i have exams all this week.
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  #4  
Old 11 December 2001, 12:03
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garett garett is offline
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Can anyone say that they're really surprised?I still say that we start a CF wide lottery to raise money.
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  #5  
Old 11 December 2001, 14:00
sthiakos
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Red face

A few years back, the Gov't said they would continue to increase spending on the DND by $x billion dollars/year (I can't remember the figure). I don't think this is any news unless they cut/raise the amount they said they were going to give anyway.

You'd think the recent events, news of the Sea King helicopters, F18 using borrowed batteries and the independant report from Alberta (on the state of our military) would have made a dent. I barely see a scratch.

But what would be enough?

------------------
S
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  #6  
Old 11 December 2001, 15:16
Cree Warrior Cree Warrior is offline
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I'll be interested to see how Just Takes Friends will increase their size. Maybe they'll pull the jump role from the Light Bn's and hand that over to JTF. I would be concerned that this move will degrade JTF instead of increasing its capabilities.
Instead of being highly regarded, and comperable to the big D, as they are now, they may end up being re-roled into a modern day CAR. With Jedi's being tasked out to different units as the need arises.
Although we do need some sort of QRF that is combat ready.
I can definitely see the new box being created and reinforced that we are so often told to think outside of. Our resources will go to Counter-Terrorism and NBC Warfare. Eventually losing our conventional fighting ability.
The money spent on air security is a prime example. It's a total waste. The highjacking a plane and crashing it into a building plan was a one shot deal. Any terrorist group that even tried to highjack a plane now would have to deal with a plane load of people that thought they were going to die, so would fight to the death.

Sua Sponte


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  #7  
Old 11 December 2001, 17:06
Marauder
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Unhappy

That's an excellent point CW, but you're forgetting that logic and common sense are not allowed to interfere with pandering to the soccer moms and "social elite" along the Rideau and particularly at 24 Sussex Dr.

The more and more I look at where we are headed, and the future political forecast, the more I think we should just fold our tents and say, "to hell with it". Yes it's quitting and yes it sucks, but I feel it would be more honest than just sitting about listening to The Ranks Higher Than God suck wind simply to hear their own voices and watching the politcal apparatus keep nicking open our capillaries and laughing as we ever so slowly bleed out. If we're gonna die, then I say we do it standing on our feet at a time and place of our choosing, by looking the politicians right in the eye and saying, "Fuck you, you caused this, call us when the world's terrorists are knocking on the door, because you refuse to allow us to do our job of defending Canada in a proactive manner. When the time comes, we'll answer the call. Unitl then, screw you and your shameful, disgusting treatment of what was once a feared and respected military entity and your continual spitting on the sacrifices of our forebearers."
The real bitch of it is, the bastards would just go about their business as if we had never existed.
God, I need a drink.
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  #8  
Old 11 December 2001, 18:13
Enfield Enfield is offline
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JTF2 just became - well, it already was since it's all we could contribute to ground ops in Afghanistan - the political golden child.
It is now the ONLY part of the CF that is adequately funded, deployable, and combat capable. So when the next crisis pops up, the Liberals can say "Look, we're participating, JTF2 is on it's way. Canada has 200 soldiers on the ground."
Well, great. It will be completely token, meanwhile the rest of the CF rots on the vine. PPCLI, RCR, and R22R just became nothing more than manpower pools for JTF yesterday. Where are they going to find 250 recruits of the high calibre they need? And can the battalions survive having 250 of their best people taken away?

On Sept 11 two dozen Canadians were killed and our economy was hit hard. And we are incapable of defending ourselves or taking part in the effort to fight terrorism. Our defense polciy is clear: we let the US defend us. We might as well give 11 billion a year direct to DoD and MoD. Canada pays something like $265 per capita for defense. I think I'll mail my $265 strait to the Pentagon.

Canada has become a nation that lets others bleed and die for it. (quote from Bercuson's editorial in National post)
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  #9  
Old 11 December 2001, 18:39
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garett garett is offline
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Does Canada let others bleed and die for it or do the Liberals, dragging Canada along with them? I do agree that Canada is slowly sliding to becoming a country without a national armed forces, just a national police force such as Iceland or Costa Rica.

Either its that or we're all just depressed.
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  #10  
Old 11 December 2001, 18:47
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Snake Snake is offline
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I hear Margaret Thatcher is between jobs right now...How about drafting her for Prime Minister (or Head Moose, or whatever you guys have up their)...

Snake
A/1/504th PIR
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  #11  
Old 11 December 2001, 19:05
farseer farseer is offline
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Unhappy

i don't think she could take the cut in pay ...
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  #12  
Old 11 December 2001, 20:38
TonyM TonyM is offline
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HOW TO SIMULATE CANADIAN ARMY LIFE

Want to be a soldier, but really don't want to commit precious years
of your life? Here are some easy ways to simulate exactly what it's
like to be a Canadian soldier!

FIELD LIFE
Surround yourself with people who smoke like chimneys, drink like
fish, bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language
that would make a teamster blush.
Pack three days worth of clothes and toiletries. Live in your
backyard
for two weeks. Go into the house only once in that two weeks to
shower.
Dig a hole in your back yard and live in it. Allow no direct contact
with your family. Your only means of communication should be with
letters that your neighbours have held for at least three weeks,
discarding two of five.
Every two days, fill in the hole, move to another part of the yard
and
dig another hole. Every time you are approximately half-way through
digging the hole, have somebody come buy, compliment you on the fine
hole you've dug and tell you to fill it in and dig it somewhere
else.
Always dig a hole next to the hole you're living in. This is your
toilet. Re-dig the hole every time your move your living hole. Fill
in
the old hole and mark it with a "Foul Ground" sign. Have somebody
remove the sign while you're not looking.
Collect a jar-full of ants, dirt, various bugs and mosquitos. Pour
them down the back of your shirt.
Have week old fruit and vegetables delivered to your back yard and
wait two weeks before eating them.
If it doesn't rain, turn on the sprinklers.
If you're incredibly tired and fed-up one night, stand guard duty in
your hole from 3 a.m. to 6 a.m. Don't sleep at all that day.
Sleep for only twenty minutes at a time. No matter how tired you
are.
Cook your meals over sterno. Prepare all meals blindfolded using all
the spices you can grope for, or none at all. Leave to sit and turn
ice cold.
Eat everything in three minutes. After eating, run two kilometers.
Buy two rolls of toilet paper. Ensure one of these two rolls is wet
all the time.
Run around your yard, periodically throwing yourself to the ground
and
crawling for at least 20 meters -- or smack your shins, knees and
elbows with a hammer.
For two days in a row, walk 10 kilometers without stopping. Wear a
back pack with fifty-five pounds of weight in it. Bitch and whine
the
whole way.
When making sandwiches, leave the bread out for six days, or until
it is hard and stale.
Have one meal a week served to you floating in it's own grease in a
large cooler or similar insulated container. Serve coffee, juice and
other beverages the same way.


GARRISON LIFE

Surround yourself with people who smoke like chimneys, drink like
fish, bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language
that would make a teamster blush.
Wear only military uniforms. Even though nobody cares, clean and
press
one dress uniform and wear it for 20 minutes.
Ask for equipment or articles of clothing you really need, have
somebody tell you that you're not entitled to it. Walk away.
Have your spouse whine about how you're always on deployment.
Whenever you're bored, get drunk. Be bored often.
Study the owner's manual for all household appliances. Routinely
take an appliance apart, clean it and put it back together.
Start a project, any project. Have somebody continually stop by and
make stupid suggestions to make the job "easier". Say "yes sir" and
do it the way they told you to do it. After they leave, go back to
doing it the right way.
Repaint your vehicle every month, whether it needs it or not.
Move every two years. Whether you want to or not. When you get to a
place you really hate, stay there for fifteen years.
Replace all your appliances and furniture with those which are
outdated, in need of constant repair or dangerous to use. Do more
with
them than you would if they were new.
If you have nothing to do, clean something that doesn't need
cleaning.

PEACEKEEPING

Surround yourself with people who smoke like chimneys, drink like
fish, bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language
that would make a teamster blush.
Have two neighbours start a fight. Get in between them and have them
hit you instead of each other.
After the neighbours have hit you several times have them calm down.
Have another, much larger person, pretend to be your ally and piss
the neighbours off again (by pretending to bomb their houses and
basically bully them around) and start them fighting. Repeat the
above.
Ask the "feuding" neighbours to throw rocks at you and call you
names
every time they see you, because of what the larger person did to
their homes.
Bring the neighbours medical supplies, food and blankets. Have them
slam the door in your face without saying thank you, because themuch
larger person bombed their houses. Get some of them to say thank
you,
have the much larger person tell you to never bring them that stuff
again.




TRAINING ENVIRONMENT

Surround yourself with people who smoke like chimneys, drink like
fish, bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language
that would make a teamster blush.
Run. Run a lot. Once in the morning, once at noon and once before
supper.
Run at least five kilometers each time, singing inane songs and
pretending you really want to do this.
Stand to attention in a parking lot in the hot sun for five hours,
or
until you pass out and fall face first into the asphalt. Have
somebody
yell at you the entire time. Have this same person nitpick at you
incessantly and then fine you $50.00 and confine you to your room
for a week, coming out only to go tot he bathroom, shower, or eat.
Have somebody yell at you every time you're stupid enough go outside
without a hat on, slouch, or put your hands in your pockets.
Cut your hair weekly, making it shorter each time, until you look
bald or look like you lost a fight with a demented sheep shearer.
Give yourself twenty minutes less than you need for lunch. Eat so
fast
you don't taste the food.
Buy a gas mask and wear it for two hours every day. Run around the
yard, while you're wearing it. Do push-ups in it until you pass out.
Fill the mask with pepper spray and recite your Social Insurance
Number BACKWARDS, have somebody yell, "Wrong. Do it again!" and
repeat this process four times before removing the mask and puking
your guts out.
Clean and shine everything to perfection. Have somebody yell at you
and call you a filthy pig. Pretend to clean and shine everything to
perfection again (changing nothing), have the same person inspect it
and say "good turnout".


INTERACTION WITH CIVILIANS

Leave the people behind who smoke like chimneys, drink like fish,
bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language that
would make a teamster blush.
When around civilians ensure to smoke like a chimney, drink like a
fish, bitch/whine/complain about EVERYTHING, and use foul language
that would make a teamster blush.
Whenever civilians say or do anything stupid (it happens a lot)shake
your head and mutter in your most contemptuous/condescending voice;
"fuckin' civvies".
Use copious amounts of acronyms, NEVER explain them. When asked to
explain shake your head and mutter in your most
contemptuous/condescending voice; "fuckin' civvies".
Have other people say stupid things to you like: "you don't pay
taxes, do you?", "you get free housing", "man, you must get paid a
lot".Shake your head and mutter in your most
contemptuous/condescending voice;
"fuckin' civvies".
Demand that everyone never thank you for anything you do for them,
look at you in a condescending manner and call you names like "G.I.
Joe", and "soldier boy". Shake your head and mutter in your most
contemptuous/condescending voice; "fuckin' civvies".
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