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Old 30 November 2015, 14:14
jason0231 jason0231 is offline
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The Believer: A Short Bio of Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi

While IS and AQI are two different organizations with some pronounced ideological differences, this concise and well-written bio on Al-Baghdadi reminds us that IS is essentially an AQI offshoot.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/es...15/thebeliever

Before he became the leader of IS, Al-Baghdadi was conducting terrorist operations in Iraq under the AQI umbrella.

I would like to get some perspectives on similarities and differences between AQ and IS. Are they really as far apart as some people think? Or are they merely working towards the same goals in (not so) different ways?
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Old 30 November 2015, 16:50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason0231 View Post
While IS and AQI are two different organizations with some pronounced ideological differences, this concise and well-written bio on Al-Baghdadi reminds us that IS is essentially an AQI offshoot.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/es...15/thebeliever

Before he became the leader of IS, Al-Baghdadi was conducting terrorist operations in Iraq under the AQI umbrella.

I would like to get some perspectives on similarities and differences between AQ and IS. Are they really as far apart as some people think? Or are they merely working towards the same goals in (not so) different ways?

IS is AQI evolved. AQI was defeated militarily (mostly) and scattered, but ideas are hard to kill. After we departed Iraq and left a vacuum behind, the remnants of AQI re-emerged like cockroaches. IS then emerged from AQI after the difference of opinion with big AQ. At least that is what I read on the internet. IS is not so much an "offshoot" of AQI as it is an evolution. Sort of like a small business crossing the threshold into a large business.
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Old 30 November 2015, 18:17
jason0231 jason0231 is offline
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From Good to Great ... or in this case, from Bad to Worse. I see your jihad and raise you a Caliphate. I think I agree with your assessment on this one; IS as the next step, or maybe the realization of AQI's long-term strategy. Based on a post from another SOCNET member, though, I need to ask you: to what extent do IS's Baathist roots make it different from AQI? I thought there were a fair number of Baathists fighting under the AQI umbrella; if that is in fact the case, did they just not have much ideological impact on its overall strategy?
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Old 30 November 2015, 19:25
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The fundamental principles are the same. Core values, if you will.
But AQ operated as a network.
What the Ba'athists bring to ISIL that makes it different is their bureaucratic heritage from the Saddam regime, with all that entails.
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Old 30 November 2015, 20:22
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Originally Posted by jason0231 View Post
From Good to Great ... or in this case, from Bad to Worse. I see your jihad and raise you a Caliphate. I think I agree with your assessment on this one; IS as the next step, or maybe the realization of AQI's long-term strategy. Based on a post from another SOCNET member, though, I need to ask you: to what extent do IS's Baathist roots make it different from AQI? I thought there were a fair number of Baathists fighting under the AQI umbrella; if that is in fact the case, did they just not have much ideological impact on its overall strategy?
The difference is that those who hold the true power in IS - and whether Al-Baghdadi is actually in charge has been debated - lies in the fact that the former Baathist's have no religious zeal. Not that Zarqawi was much of a pious man, no matter how reborn he was in prison, but the most prominent voices in Islam have decried, in detail, how un-islamic ISIS actually is. If they were truly religiously motivated all of that would matter to them but instead they continue to denounce anyone as takfir, at convenience, no matter what anyone says.

So...sure, it makes for a great cover story and they love selling that message to the youth...but the reality is that their top leadership is filled with people who probably don't even own a Quran.

They're more concerned with having their cake and eating it than they are with the realization of a Caliphate. But the messaging of the IS has to remain steady in looking for that outcome as it inspires potential and current followers to no end. The systematic degradation of any pleasure and past time other than death and religion also makes for a much simpler community to control.
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Old 1 December 2015, 05:41
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Since people are mentioning Al-Baghdadi, I find it completely hilarious (because you almost have to laugh to keep from choking people) that the sheep collectively insist that ISIS is "not Islam". They'll shriek it from the rooftops as loud as they can. If you say it is, you're a racist bigot islamophobe, etc, etc, etc...........that they will scream with the same vigor.

Yet, the fucker in charge, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi --- has a BA, MA, & PhD in Islamic studies from the Islamic University in Baghdad. Yup, clearly the guy doesn't know what Islam is. Because POTUS and his idiot lackeys say so. Just a JV team......
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Old 14 June 2016, 10:52
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British (Daily Mail, Mirror) and Turkish (Yenis Safak) sources are reporting that Daesh is claiming he's dead, killed in a U.S. led airstrike over the weekend.

http://www.dailymailDOTco.uk/news/article-3640726/ISIS-leader-Abu-Bakr-al-Baghdadi-killed-air-strike-Raqqa-according-pro-Islamic-State-news-agency.html

http://www.yenisafakDOTcom/en/world/daesh-leader-al-baghdadi-was-killed-2479848
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Old 14 June 2016, 10:55
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I sure hope that's true. Best news all day.
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Old 14 June 2016, 11:13
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"Black Flags" The Rise of ISIS. Joby Warrick about half way through If its not Islam Im not sure what you would call it.

Awarded the 2016 Pulitzer Prize for General Nonfiction, Joby Warrick traces how the strain of militant Islam behind ISIS first arose in a remote Jordanian prison and spread with the unwitting aid of two American presidents.
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Old 14 June 2016, 22:39
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The thing is, ISIS or Daesh or ISIL origniated with al qaeda in iraq, but was able to proliferate due to the syrian civil war and the instability in iraq. There are many baathists who sided with them originally as they(isis) were able to bridge the sunni shia sectarian divide and provide a means for the sunnis to be recognized by the baghdad gov. They were initially seen as liberators but have turned out to be far from the case. There is still quite a strong support system for the sunni fight in ramadi and anbar, albiet not along the ISIS caliphate lines.
The reason they grew so rapidly in iraq and syria was literally due to the sectarian issues.

Mosul will definitely be the hallmark of IS/Daesh iraq campaign. If the shias get involved it will definitely further the sunni shia divide of iraq and could actually cause worse bloodshed as far as widespread sunni shia violence then what IS(daesh) was capable of.

Even with Daesh or ISIS as they are called being kicked from cities, the stability of iraq will be in question as a moderate government is basicaly non existant. Not only do the kurds not trust Bdad but many sunnis do not either. It will prbably turn into a 2006-2008 sunni shia uprising where they kill each other for a year or two before it slows down. The thing is, with the shia militias being armed, the only real threat to them is either the civiians or hashd al watani. Iraq is literally nothing but a militia state now, doomed to follow what the clerics and mullahs say. The US has no control over anything really anymore in iraq.
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Old 15 June 2016, 06:51
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I watched this Frontline special on ISIS ("The Secret History of ISIS") and thought it was well done. They describe the eventual rise of Al-Baghdadi.

http://wwwDOTpbs.org/wgbh/frontline/...story-of-isis/
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Old 15 June 2016, 06:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soot View Post
British (Daily Mail, Mirror) and Turkish (Yenis Safak) sources are reporting that Daesh is claiming he's dead, killed in a U.S. led airstrike over the weekend.

http://www.dailymailDOTco.uk/news/article-3640726/ISIS-leader-Abu-Bakr-al-Baghdadi-killed-air-strike-Raqqa-according-pro-Islamic-State-news-agency.html

http://www.yenisafakDOTcom/en/world/daesh-leader-al-baghdadi-was-killed-2479848
That would be a wonderful development if killing their leaders actually accomplished what we think it accomplishes. Maybe this death - if true - does have the desired effect. Hoping so.
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