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  #21  
Old 22 June 2016, 21:14
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Originally Posted by ricardo View Post
Would this be applicable to non-Arab muslims like Malaysians and Indonesians?
No. Not in my experience. Different culture and climate. May happen in some of the more rural areas, but never really saw it. Or the genetic characteristics associated with it.

I do know of some non-Muslim countries/area I have worked/lived in, where this is prevalent though as well. Sometimes done to retain tribal roots/associations and also keep the money in the family.

Back many years ago, I read there were some problems with this in Amish communities as well. So they were traveling up to Canada, other parts of the USA, to seek wives.

But, this is common in ecology studies as well. One area I worked in, we were concerned as a major land concession was going to cut off the migration routes for a couple populations of Elephants. The concern is when one group becomes isolated, then inbreeding develops which eventually depletes the species sustainability.

There was a problem many years ago in Florida with this, concerning the Florida Panther (a Cougar sub species). Due to the limited numbers, and isolations from other cougar populations , the Florida panthers were exhibiting common trait of inbreeding. So biologist introduced cougars from other areas of the USA into Florida. Now some "Purists" objected cause not the same sub species. But, what did happen is it saved the Florida Panther (Cougar) population. Within just two generations all the genetic anomalies had disappeared.

So maybe the USMC and 82nd Airborne needs to get busy in Afghanistan.
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Last edited by leopardprey; 22 June 2016 at 21:27.
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  #22  
Old 22 June 2016, 21:34
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Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post
No. Not in my experience. Different culture and climate. May happen in some of the more rural areas, but never really saw it. Or the genetic characteristics associated with it.

I do know of some non-Muslim countries/area I have worked/lived in, where this is prevalent though as well. Sometimes done to retain tribal roots/associations and also keep the money in the family.

Back many years ago, I read there were some problems with this in Amish communities as well. So they were traveling up to Canada, other parts of the USA, to seek wives.

But, this is common in ecology studies as well. One ares I worked in, we were concerned as a major land concession was going to cut off the migration routes for a couple populations of Elephants. The concern is when one group becomes isolated, then inbreeding develops which eventually depletes the species sustainability.

There was a problem many years ago in Florida with this, concerning the Florida Panther (a Cougar sub species). Due to the limited numbers, and isolations from other cougar populations , the Florida panthers were exhibiting common trait of inbreeding. So biologist introduced cougars from other areas of the USA into Florida. Now some "Purists" objected cause not the same sub species. But, what did happen is it saved the Florida Panther (Cougar) population. Within just two generations all the genetic anomalies had disappeared.
Here in NYC, for all its diversity, there are some insulated communities that face inbreeding problems.
The Lubavitcher community has encountered health problems after a few generations of inbreeding.
For those of you not familiar with who the Lubavitcher are, they are a very small insulated sub sect of ultra ultra ultra orthodox Jews.
Within the ultra orthodox community are the even more orthodox Hasidim, and within the small Hasidim community, are the Lubavitcher.
I remember reading an article a few years back about how the small Lubavitcher community in Brooklyn was deliberately exchanging families with the small Lubavitcher community in Australia to try to broaden the gene pool
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  #23  
Old 22 June 2016, 21:45
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^Interesting, never heard of this community. Never been to NYC.
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  #24  
Old 22 June 2016, 21:48
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Originally Posted by Bravo Five Romeo View Post
Here in NYC, for all its diversity, there are some insulated communities that face inbreeding problems.
The Lubavitcher community has encountered health problems after a few generations of inbreeding.
For those of you not familiar with who the Lubavitcher are, they are a very small insulated sub sect of ultra ultra ultra orthodox Jews.
Within the ultra orthodox community are the even more orthodox Hasidim, and within the small Hasidim community, are the Lubavitcher.
I remember reading an article a few years back about how the small Lubavitcher community in Brooklyn was deliberately exchanging families with the small Lubavitcher community in Australia to try to broaden the gene pool
I always thought it extended beyond just the Orthodox Jews. Just regular old athiest Jews in NYC always seemed to interbreed. Isn't that where Tay-Sachs syndrome comes from? I mean at the end of the day the Hasids have the same antidiluvian mentality towards women that Haj does, hence the cousins thing, and the normal Jews just have the "you'll only marry an accountant" deal, which pretty much narrows down the gene pool as well.

Hip displasyia- yeah, that too. I knew a SEAL who was of Syrian descent who had both hips replaced by the age of 30 and I very undiplomatically was like "I don't suppose you parents were cousins?' And he was like "Fuck yeah they were. I yell at them about it all the time!"
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  #25  
Old 22 June 2016, 22:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bravo Five Romeo View Post
Here in NYC, for all its diversity, there are some insulated communities that face inbreeding problems.
The Lubavitcher community has encountered health problems after a few generations of inbreeding.
For those of you not familiar with who the Lubavitcher are, they are a very small insulated sub sect of ultra ultra ultra orthodox Jews.
Within the ultra orthodox community are the even more orthodox Hasidim, and within the small Hasidim community, are the Lubavitcher.
I remember reading an article a few years back about how the small Lubavitcher community in Brooklyn was deliberately exchanging families with the small Lubavitcher community in Australia to try to broaden the gene pool
Yep, I spent an extended Sabbath with a Lubavitch family with my then Jewish wife. They were actively trying to bring us into the sect and your comment on the exchange is dead on. It was interesting being a squat, muscled Jew among the mostly rail thin Hasidim.
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  #26  
Old 22 June 2016, 22:50
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OK motherfuckers, I'm from western Virginia, not West Virginia. HUGE difference. We have enough sense to wear condoms when we fuck our cousins.
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  #27  
Old 22 June 2016, 22:52
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OK motherfuckers, I'm from western Virginia, not West Virginia. HUGE difference.
western Virginians turn off the light before sleeping with their cousins. They're fancy.

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Last edited by KidA; 22 June 2016 at 23:05.
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  #28  
Old 22 June 2016, 23:51
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Is the author speaking of all Muslims from all walks of life, or specifically to orthodox Muslims in the Arab world?
It's a matter of degree. Muhammad didn't create the tradition of cousin marriage, he took a common practice in Arab culture and formalized it as morally superior. Cousin marriage was already a normal thing, just not a thing for everyone and certainly not mandatory, until Muhammad. It was several centuries before Islam reached central and southeastern Asia, which might not have had much experience with cousin marriage prior to that, and those cultures had more ingrained practices that Islam layered over instead of replacing. Cousin marriages in southern and southeastern Asia are a more hit or miss proposition as likely to be due to local factors as to anything Islamic. Hinduism has its own version of cousin or uncle marriage related to keeping the family within their jati (job field) within their larger varna (caste). When the Mughals imposed their flavor of Sharia in India for two centuries, the locals already had a stricter and far older set of marriage rules.

An exception is the Stans. Some of the northern 10 tribes of Israelites conquered by the Assyrian Empire eventually wound up being colonized on the northeastern frontier of one empire or another. A lot of place names in the Stans reflect that. Until forcibly converted to Islam at a much later date, they continued with Judaism to some extent and retained many of their cultural practices, including not voluntarily marrying outsiders. Afghanistan has always and forever been an unruly place 4 centuries behind the rest of the world and best avoided if possible, so even the Islamization of that place never completely removed some cultural elements that differentiate Afghans from other Muslims and are in many cases rooted in vestiges of Judaism. A fair chunk of the Afghans were therefore quite inbred well before they became Muslims, and reflect the same characteristics of chronic inbreeding found profusely in Arabs but less so in other Muslim ethnicities.
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  #29  
Old 22 June 2016, 23:53
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  #30  
Old 23 June 2016, 00:10
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So, their gene pool needs chlorox....


Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDog0311 View Post
Awesome read. I remember hearing a while back that doctors looking to research genetic disorders go to the ME.
Correct, from what I read, being accepted for a residency at King Faisal Hospital in Riyadh is like winning the lottery for such specialists.
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  #31  
Old 23 June 2016, 01:28
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Originally Posted by ET1/ss nuke View Post
It's a matter of degree. Muhammad didn't create the tradition of cousin marriage, he took a common practice in Arab culture and formalized it as morally superior. Cousin marriage was already a normal thing, just not a thing for everyone and certainly not mandatory, until Muhammad. It was several centuries before Islam reached central and southeastern Asia, which might not have had much experience with cousin marriage prior to that, and those cultures had more ingrained practices that Islam layered over instead of replacing. Cousin marriages in southern and southeastern Asia are a more hit or miss proposition as likely to be due to local factors as to anything Islamic. Hinduism has its own version of cousin or uncle marriage related to keeping the family within their jati (job field) within their larger varna (caste). When the Mughals imposed their flavor of Sharia in India for two centuries, the locals already had a stricter and far older set of marriage rules.

An exception is the Stans. Some of the northern 10 tribes of Israelites conquered by the Assyrian Empire eventually wound up being colonized on the northeastern frontier of one empire or another. A lot of place names in the Stans reflect that. Until forcibly converted to Islam at a much later date, they continued with Judaism to some extent and retained many of their cultural practices, including not voluntarily marrying outsiders. Afghanistan has always and forever been an unruly place 4 centuries behind the rest of the world and best avoided if possible, so even the Islamization of that place never completely removed some cultural elements that differentiate Afghans from other Muslims and are in many cases rooted in vestiges of Judaism. A fair chunk of the Afghans were therefore quite inbred well before they became Muslims, and reflect the same characteristics of chronic inbreeding found profusely in Arabs but less so in other Muslim ethnicities.
The biggest reason I have heard of the Arab "marrying your cousin" thing is that the family of the woman is still required to give a dowry. The reason they have cousins marry is because they're so fucking greedy this ensures the wealth stays in the family. The fact that Muhammed did it too basically froze that shit in carbonite for all eternity with those guys.

There's a Jew joke somewhere in there too.
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  #32  
Old 23 June 2016, 02:24
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Originally Posted by MakoZeroSix View Post
I have been telling people this for years. Most of our citizens can't conceptualize it. You can't swing a dead cat over there without hitting a retard, midget, or an albino.

I dated a Lebanese broad whose parents were first cousins. She was one of 10 kids. 4 stillborn. 2 albinos (one of them retard) One retard/midget. 3 normal. Holy shit. That apartment they had was a shit show I tell you.
Sounds like what you'd find in a traveling carnival, or the opening or a politically incorrect joke.
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  #33  
Old 23 June 2016, 02:32
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Originally Posted by DirtyDog0311 View Post
The biggest reason I have heard of the Arab "marrying your cousin" thing is that the family of the woman is still required to give a dowry. The reason they have cousins marry is because they're so fucking greedy this ensures the wealth stays in the family. The fact that Muhammed did it too basically froze that shit in carbonite for all eternity with those guys.

There's a Jew joke somewhere in there too.
Maybe it's a karmic self destruct mechanism.
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  #34  
Old 23 June 2016, 02:57
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The art of picking boogers, and then eating them, takes generations of inbreeding to perfect. This article, and many before it only cement that fact.
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  #35  
Old 23 June 2016, 04:03
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Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post

So maybe the USMC and 82nd Airborne needs to get busy in Afghanistan.

Probably just cheaper to bus Jarheads to Fayettville on a 96, and the 82nd to Jacsonville on a 4 day.
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  #36  
Old 23 June 2016, 08:58
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Which one did you date?
I dont know whats worse the fact that you wrote that or the fact that I laughed so hard when I read it.
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  #37  
Old 23 June 2016, 09:43
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Originally Posted by MakoZeroSix View Post
I have been telling people this for years. Most of our citizens can't conceptualize it. You can't swing a dead cat over there without hitting a retard, midget, or an albino.

I dated a Lebanese broad whose parents were first cousins. She was one of 10 kids. 4 stillborn. 2 albinos (one of them retard) One retard/midget. 3 normal. Holy shit. That apartment they had was a shit show I tell you.
Sounds like you had a great time.

Did it work out?

Sad thing is no one believes me about midget suicide bombers in Iraq.
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  #38  
Old 23 June 2016, 09:58
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A quick survey of the medical journal literature finds a lot of support for this issue.
There appear to be indications that cultural factors beyond Islam contribute, as in some ME countries it's just as much of an issue statistically for non-Muslim populations as it is for Muslim populations. And it doesn't appear to be as much of an issue for Muslims outside of the ME.
Interesting anthropological question.
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  #39  
Old 23 June 2016, 11:01
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There appear to be indications that cultural factors beyond Islam contribute, as in some ME countries it's just as much of an issue statistically for non-Muslim populations as it is for Muslim populations.
Borders? I mean, you're still stuck with a captive audience as far as the dating pool, regardless of which side of the mosque door you're on. Being that non-Muslims in ME countries are relatively "new," the remainders will eventually catch up. For example, I suspect the Indian population of the UAE will be experiencing the same problems in 50 generations (if they stay that long).
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  #40  
Old 23 June 2016, 11:58
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Originally Posted by ET1/ss nuke View Post
It's a matter of degree. Muhammad didn't create the tradition of cousin marriage, he took a common practice in Arab culture and formalized it as morally superior. Cousin marriage was already a normal thing, just not a thing for everyone and certainly not mandatory, until Muhammad. It was several centuries before Islam reached central and southeastern Asia, which might not have had much experience with cousin marriage prior to that, and those cultures had more ingrained practices that Islam layered over instead of replacing. Cousin marriages in southern and southeastern Asia are a more hit or miss proposition as likely to be due to local factors as to anything Islamic. Hinduism has its own version of cousin or uncle marriage related to keeping the family within their jati (job field) within their larger varna (caste). When the Mughals imposed their flavor of Sharia in India for two centuries, the locals already had a stricter and far older set of marriage rules.

An exception is the Stans. Some of the northern 10 tribes of Israelites conquered by the Assyrian Empire eventually wound up being colonized on the northeastern frontier of one empire or another. A lot of place names in the Stans reflect that. Until forcibly converted to Islam at a much later date, they continued with Judaism to some extent and retained many of their cultural practices, including not voluntarily marrying outsiders. Afghanistan has always and forever been an unruly place 4 centuries behind the rest of the world and best avoided if possible, so even the Islamization of that place never completely removed some cultural elements that differentiate Afghans from other Muslims and are in many cases rooted in vestiges of Judaism. A fair chunk of the Afghans were therefore quite inbred well before they became Muslims, and reflect the same characteristics of chronic inbreeding found profusely in Arabs but less so in other Muslim ethnicities.

That's well written!
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