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  #21  
Old 26 January 2008, 11:59
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Originally Posted by iraqgunz
Mailbuoy,

Forget Barry Scheck or Allen Dershowitz. If I ever need a lawyer I am calling your ass in a heartbeat.
+1 . That was fucking excellent. I had a really good laugh thanks. More seriously though I think that needs to be sent the good Col. so he can think a little about the error in his ways.
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  #22  
Old 26 January 2008, 12:03
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LA Times piece...

Los Angeles Times
January 26, 2008

Marines Were Shot At, Army Expert Testifies

A Humvee in their convoy bore evidence of small-arms fire, an explosives specialist says. Up to 19 Afghan civilians died in the March incident under investigation.

By David Zucchino, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer

CAMP LEJEUNE, N.C. — An Army explosives expert testified Friday that a Humvee was hit by small-arms fire after a suicide car bomb attack last March on a Marine convoy whose gunners have been accused of killing as many as 19 Afghan civilians. Sgt. 1st Class Jason Mero offered the first definitive support for testimony by Marines on the convoy, who said their gunners fired because the Marines believed enemies were shooting at them. Attorneys for the Marines have said they fired on gunmen, not civilians.

Mero told a court of inquiry he was "100% certain" that small-arms fire struck the gunner's turret shield on the convoy's second Humvee, which was targeted by the car bomber. He said he was 90% certain that the Humvee's windshield and headlight were hit by small-arms fire.

An Afghan human rights group has accused the Marines from a special operations unit of firing indiscriminately at civilian vehicles and pedestrians after the suicide attack. An Army colonel in charge of the area, saying he was "deeply ashamed," told reporters and Afghans in May that the Marines had killed 19 Afghan civilians and wounded 50.

Mero, who examined the Humvee within two days of the March 4 incident, said he was pressured by the Air Force colonel in charge of the investigation to alter his conclusions. He said Col. Patrick Pihana first agreed that bullets had struck the Humvee, but changed his mind after talking to Afghan civilians near the bomb site.
"He was wanting me to change my opinion . . . to buck up his opinion" that the convoy was not fired on, Mero said. Though Pihana's pressure made him uncomfortable, Mero said, he did not change his conclusions.

Pihana has testified during the three-week inquiry, but only in classified sessions closed to the press and public.

Mero said he based his conclusions on an examination of several "divots" in the windshield and a hole in the headlight. A hard plastic coating on the turret shield was bent inward by the impact of a bullet fired from outside the Humvee, "just missing the gunner," he testified.

Mero also provided the inquiry's first description of the car bomb, which slightly wounded the Humvee gunner but did not cause extensive damage to convoy vehicles. He said the bomb -- made of fuel oil, ammonium nitrate fertilizer and mortars -- detonated prematurely about 15 feet from the second of the convoy's six Humvees.

Under cross-examination by a government attorney, Mero conceded that his investigation would have been more thorough if he had inspected the bomb site. But he said the Afghan government asked him not to travel there because local Afghans were "very, very angry."

Earlier Friday, a retired Marine master sergeant testified that the Marine company was resented and undermined when it arrived in Afghanistan last winter -- and wasn't provided such basics as bunks and fuel.

The special operations command "really didn't want us to do well" and placed "obstacles in our path," said Master Sgt. Jim Elder, the company's operations chief.
Elder's testimony, for the defense, was the first to suggest rivalries within the Marine command in addition to tensions between Marine Special Operations Company F and U.S. Army commanders.

Such conflicts could be useful to the defense if they leave the impression that the Marine unit is being made a scapegoat by rivals.

The actions of two of the company's top commanders are being investigated by the court of inquiry, which is a fact-finding body, not a criminal court.

The three Marine officers on the inquiry panel will report their findings to the head of the Marine Corps central command. No one has been charged in the case.

Attorneys for Maj. Fred C. Galvin, the company commander, and Capt. Vincent J. Noble, the convoy commander, questioned Elder about the unit's reception as the first Marine special operations company deployed in combat.

Even before deploying, Elder said, Galvin had a "terrible" and "adversarial" working relationship with his battalion commander because the commander had not selected Galvin to lead the unit.

And a Marine liaison major in Afghanistan who was supposed to provide equipment for the company "did not deliver," Elder testified.

The company was assigned to a run-down camp that lacked bunks, fuel, guards and food, and had fecal matter in the drinking water.

Though the liaison major was a Marine, Elder said, he developed "Stockholm syndrome" -- identifying with Army commanders who dominated the joint special operations command. "He Army'd up," Elder said with disdain. Elder, now retired, was among the most outspoken of the three dozen witnesses who have testified in public at the inquiry, the first for the Marine Corps in half a century.

The special operations command ordered the Marine company out of Afghanistan after the shootings.
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  #23  
Old 26 January 2008, 13:43
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US SOF is getting to big, to many people without proper knowledge trying to be chiefs. Everybody wants to make general.
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  #24  
Old 13 March 2008, 13:42
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Report complete on Marine shooting

Report Complete on Marine Shooting
Associated Press | March 08, 2008
RALEIGH, N.C. - A special panel that heard testimony about a Marine shooting that killed up to 19 Afghan civilians delivered its report Friday, but it won't be made public.

The findings of the Court of Inquiry are classified, said Marine Corps spokesman Lt. Col. Sean Gibson. The court, a rarely used administrative hearing, was expected to recommend whether to file criminal charges against two officers who led the special operations unit accused in the March 2007 incident.

The officers' military attorneys aren't allowed to discuss the case, and their civilian lawyers didn't immediately return messages seeking comment Friday.

The report by a panel of Marine officers was filed with Lt. Gen. Samuel Helland, commander of Marine Corps Forces Central Command in Tampa, Fla. The general's attorneys will review the report and send it to Helland for final action, Gibson said. No timetable for a decision has been released.

Gibson said he didn't know whether any part of the report eventually would be made public. More than half the 47 witnesses testified at least partly in classified sessions during the 17-day hearing in January.

"Due to the inclusion of classified information, the overall report is classified," Gibson said.

Several members of the special operations unit testified that a car bomb targeted their convoy as they returned from a patrol to the Pakistan border. The Marines said the suicide bombing initiated a well-planned attack, and they fired back when fired upon.

But an Afghan human rights organization accused the Marines of firing indiscriminately at pedestrians and motorists along a 10-mile stretch of highway. It also called the suicide bombing an isolated event.

An Army report determined up to 19 Afghans were killed, but the officers' lawyers said they believed the death toll was no more than five.

Helland will decide whether to file charges against the company commander, Maj. Fred C. Galvin, and a platoon leader, Capt. Vincent J. Noble. Possible charges include failure to obey a lawful order and dereliction of duty.

Galvin and Noble were leading the first company deployed by the Marines' new special operations command.

Eight members of the company were sent back to Camp Lejeune after the incident. The rest of the company was ordered out of Afghanistan and sent to ships of the 26th Marine Expeditionary Unit in the Persian Gulf.

About two months after the shooting, Army Col. John Nicholson, then in charge of regular ground forces in Nangahar Province, publicly apologized for the shootings. Marine Corps commandant Gen. James T. Conway said the apology was premature.
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  #25  
Old 14 March 2008, 16:05
O'DubhGhaill O'DubhGhaill is offline
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Now that he's retired, does anyone have a photo or link to a photo of MSgt Jim Elder they can PM me -- I served with the Elder "Eldog" bros in BCo, 2d Recon Bn, the younger of which was in 2d platoon with me, and I believe this might be him...
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  #26  
Old 14 March 2008, 16:50
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He is not the younger brother. He's the oldest.
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  #27  
Old 15 March 2008, 22:33
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Quote:
I served with the Elder "Eldog" bros in BCo, 2d Recon Bn...
PM inbound
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  #28  
Old 16 March 2008, 05:35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by islandrecce12
Excactly what MARSOC is going to encounter everywhere they operate



BULL. SHIT.



10% rule dude. Marines have their share too. That statement was bullshit. 100%
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  #29  
Old 17 March 2008, 12:12
O'DubhGhaill O'DubhGhaill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverbullet
He is not the younger brother. He's the oldest.
Damn, at the time I thought for sure Elpup was going to be the lifer!

ReconB2, PM replied.
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  #30  
Old 17 March 2008, 12:54
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There were 3 of them in the Corps. You appear to be talking about the middle or youngest brother.

2 stayed until 20, one got out at around the 6 yr mark.
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  #31  
Old 17 March 2008, 14:36
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O'DubhGhaill

UR Box is stuffed:D

B2
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  #32  
Old 17 March 2008, 20:17
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Mailbuoy,

That was some funny shit..:D:D:D
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  #33  
Old 28 January 2016, 21:45
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It appears LTG Nicholson will soon be GEN Nicholson, and CG in AF.
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  #34  
Old 28 January 2016, 21:59
8654maine 8654maine is offline
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Why do turds get promoted? Sigh.
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  #35  
Old 28 January 2016, 22:16
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Originally Posted by 8654maine View Post
Why do turds get promoted? Sigh.
"Turd" is not an appropriate term to apply to LTG Nicholson. His conduct as regards Fox Company was, quite simply, unforgivable. He can never possibly atone for his actions.
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  #36  
Old 29 January 2016, 06:57
8654maine 8654maine is offline
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True.
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  #37  
Old 29 January 2016, 11:54
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The good news is that troops serving in AF know exactly what to expect from their next CG. LTG Nicholson has a demonstrable track record for jumping to conclusions and throwing US personnel under the bus. Even after a military court completely exonerated the Fox Company Marines, and showed LTG Nicholson's assertions to be baseless (I'm being charitable with my choice of words), LTG Nicholson refuses to accept responsibility or acknowledge that he was wrong.
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  #38  
Old 29 January 2016, 11:59
WGH0922 WGH0922 is offline
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Fred and some of his Marines still suffer today from the knee jerk reactions of LTG Nicholson and others regarding the events of March 2007 and the bullshit statements made by them afterward. I can't post a link here due to restrictions but a Google search of "Fred Galvin USMC" will point you in the right direction.
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  #39  
Old 29 January 2016, 12:27
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Well, he sure has all the bling and clinkety-clank on his uniform, doesn't he?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_W..._Nicholson.jpg
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  #40  
Old 29 January 2016, 14:36
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Originally Posted by WGH0922 View Post
Fred and some of his Marines still suffer today from the knee jerk reactions of LTG Nicholson and others regarding the events of March 2007 and the bullshit statements made by them afterward. I can't post a link here due to restrictions but a Google search of "Fred Galvin USMC" will point you in the right direction.
I spoke with Galvin a few weeks ago, there are some upcoming segments on CBS I believe regarding this situation. I don't do Facebook, but Fred has some folks in his corner who have created a page that explains his case, and calls for people to contact their elected officials and demand full exoneration vs the BS statement of "acted appropriately ".

Fred is one great dude, and is solely trying to clear the names of his men.
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