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  #61  
Old 2 August 2008, 16:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matchanu
Sending a unit which is, by it's nature, an LEO contingent, or rescue contingent, to a warfighter school, makes no sence at all.
X2. When I went to Sniper School in Quantico, 4 HRT guys were in the course as well. I think there were also 4 SEALs, 2 Rangers, and 1 SF guy. The FBI dudes opted out of the field training events -- at least those that involved land-nav and stalking (possibly some of the other stuff, but I can't remember). The non-Marine types went through all of the rest of the training, and in-fact, a SEAL had the highest stalking score of our class (we called him "Stalking Bob").

The question then is asked, what was the benefit of those guys attending this course? Could they have not gotten the marksmanship training from their own personnel, or from any other org that taught long-distance marksmanship? Because if you remove the complexity of getting into a position to take a shot(s) (and then being able to exfil safely from that site) from the training, you no longer have what I would term as a "sniper." You simply have a guy behind the scope of a rifle, and while he might be a great shot, he is not a military sniper.

These guys probably felt that they could just as easily roll up on the problem, download their shit from their Suburbans, and stroll over to a position where a shooting mat was laid out and just wait for a shot. Which might just be the case for them (although since that course, I have seen a number of Fed, State, and Local LEO guys in situations where discreet movement and firing would very much be useful). But their not attending that portion of the training (and for those that have attended, stalking is easily the part of the course that sucks the most) clearly demonstrated two things to the rest of us; 1) these guys were cops, not warriors -- if this starts a flame war, whatever, but their personal mindset was not on doing whatever it takes to be able to kill someone; and 2) their parent org was not of a warrior mindset. This last point -- and I will try and be careful with regards to OPSEC -- was driven home during and after the course when two Fed LEO org senior leadership types were given an opportunity to view USMC sniper training. In one of these cases, the leadership was invited to sit behind the spotting scope and find these students that surely were quite visible in the open field in front of them. My instructors (one who lurks on this board) told us not a single student was detected by these guys that day. It apparently shook up some of their previous perceptions of how they would do their job, with regards to the sheer numbers of graduates of these courses and the standards to which students were expected to be able to perform.

Like many on this board, I have worked with a great many LEO-types. And some of those guys were/are CG. Many of these people I've worked with are SWAT-types. There are a couple of guys that I would not mind their being on a mission with me -- they are solid and experienced people. But there are not MANY that I would want to come with me, and there are NO LEO units that I would want to do a military mission with. NOT ONE. At the same time, and because of my own focus, priorities, and experiences -- I think it is only safe and fair to expect that there are not many LEO-types that would want me to accompany them on a police mission. I'm sure that I don't have the right mindset and woudl jeopardize the success of that mission.

Whatever. At the end of typing all of this up, I just realized how silly and ludicrous this idea is -- and I once again state that there are some admirals that surely made themselves feel very good with this idea. Too bad they could give a fuck less about the nation and the people they are fucking with when they engage their brain-housing groups....
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  #62  
Old 2 August 2008, 16:22
L1E0D8ET L1E0D8ET is offline
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Lightbulb The process.

After a quick search on our intranet, I found an external (internet) link that I can release that lists the application process.

http://www.uscg.mil/hq/cg1/cgpc/epm/AO/Seals.asp
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  #63  
Old 2 August 2008, 16:49
BigZippo BigZippo is offline
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I am currently stationed at the MSRT and a currant member of the DAS (Direct Action Section). I don't think most people know what we do here or there is confusion about our purpose. I would be happy to answer any questions that I can that wont violate OPSEC, please PM me.
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  #64  
Old 2 August 2008, 16:50
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BUD/S is a selection course! When I was in, you learned how to dive and do demo and shoot and move during second and third phase, but all of that was just a foundation for things to be acquired later on. BUD/S was about do you have what it takes to suck it up and drive on no matter what obstacle stands in your way. The real skills that you would use everyday as a frogman were learned and perfected later on in STT(I'm old) and during your workups and at whatever schools you were sent too. I realize with the expansion of the training pipeline in recent years guys are coming to the Teams better prepared to do the job than in my day. But what does the Coast Guard stand to benefit by having itself a small group of guys who now are trained to the same standard as a bigger, better funded, better supported, more experienced group of guys who have been doing this stuff much longer.

With that being said, who from NSW signed off on this as being a good idea.
I just hope this doesn't turn into a situation where the standards are lowered to allow individuals to complete training. I've personally seen FNs who were attending BUD/S and did not meet the standards allowed to continue on so as to avoid some sort of diplomatic issue.
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  #65  
Old 2 August 2008, 18:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigZippo View Post
I am currently stationed at the MSRT and a currant member of the DAS (Direct Action Section). I don't think most people know what we do here or there is confusion about our purpose. I would be happy to answer any questions that I can that wont violate OPSEC, please PM me.



If it doesn't violate OPSEC, post it out here for all of us. If it does violate OPSEC then you shouldn't even be talking about it via PM.


Personally, I'm curious what you have to say. I have a feeling that I know what's coming but I will let you have your say before I open my trap. The floor is yours. Why is this a good idea?
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  #66  
Old 2 August 2008, 20:04
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As everyone has stated in several different ways--you don't dabble in special operations. Sure there are some guys who do a hitch or two and call it quits, but we expect them to live the lifestyle while they're doing the job. Guys who just want a title or want to wear a shiny pin don't work out well or stick around long.

Another question--guys who try out for BUD/S OBLISERVE for at least three years in the Navy, even if they don't make it through training. What about a Coastie who steps up to the plate and strikes out. Does he owe the Navy three years like everyone else? I'll bet the USCG is not too keen on that. Also, if they allow the guy to go back to the Coast Guard immediately after he quits, we'll have a bunch of lame brains sign up for the Coast Guard instead of the Navy to get their shot at BUD/S.

I think the only way this will work is if the successful USCG BUD/S graduate does an interservice transfer from light blue to blue. Otherwise this is just a social experiment and a hideous drain on resources.
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  #67  
Old 2 August 2008, 20:33
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PT Standards, How do they stack up?

This alone demonstrates the checklist mentality of this service. No freedom of maneuver, just go down the checklist. Lots of worthless minutia


CG SEAL Training Application
Physical Fitness Screening Criticalities
Reference: MILPERSMAN 1220-100 Exhibit 1 & OPNAVINST 6110.1F
1) Swim, 500 yards:
a. Time limit: 12 minutes 30 seconds, (competitive time: 10:00)
b. Nonstop swim
c. Utilizing breast or side stroke
d. May push off pool sides during turns
2) 10 Minute Rest Period
3) Push-ups:
a. Time limit: 2 minutes, (minimum repetitions 42, competitive 79)
b. Performed on a firm or suitability padded, level surface
c. Shoes Optional
d. Begin in the front-leaning rest position, palms of hands placed on floor directly beneath or slightly wider than shoulders
e. Feet together on floor
f. Back, buttocks & legs shall be straight from head to heels throughout test
g. Toes & palms of hands shall remain in contact with floor
h. Feet shall not contact a wall or other vertical support surface
i. Timer shall signal start & call out 15-second intervals until 2 minutes elapse
j. Lower entire body as a single unit by elbows until upper arms, shoulders, and lower back are aligned & parallel to deck
k. Return to starting position
l. Rest in the up position only
m. Repeat correctly as many times as possible in 2 minutes
n. Incorrect repetitions will not be counted
o. Test is ended if participant:
i. Touches deck with any part of body except hands & feet
ii. Raises one or both feet or hands off deck or ground
iii. Fails to keep back, buttock, & legs straight from head to heels
4) 2 Minute Rest Period
5) Curl-ups (sit-ups):
a. Time limit: 2 minutes, (minimum repetitions 50, competitive 79)
b. Conducted with partner on level surface on a blanket, mat or other suitable padding
c. Start lying flat on back with knees bent, heels about 10 inches from buttocks.
d. Arms shall be folded across & touching chest with hands touching upper chest or shoulders
e. Feet shall be held to floor only by partner’s hands
f. Timer shall signal start for participant & call out 15 second intervals until 2 minutes elapse
CG SEAL Training Application
Physical Fitness Screening Criticalities
Reference: MILPERSMAN 1220-100 Exhibit 1 & OPNAVINST 6110.1F
g. Curl body up, touching elbows to thighs while keeping hands in contact with chest or shoulders
h. Lower back touching lower edge of shoulder blades to deck
i. Rest is in the up or down position.
j. Repeat correctly as many times as possible in 2 minutes
k. Incorrect repetitions will not be counted
l. Test is ended if participate:
i. Lowers legs
ii. Raises feet off ground or floor
iii. Lifts buttocks off ground or floor
iv. Fails to keep arms folded across & touching chest
v. Fails to keep contact with chest or shoulders
6) 2 Minute Rest Period
7) Pull-ups:
a. Time limit: none, (minimum repetitions 6, competitive 11)
b. Start by grasping pull-up bar & hang straight down
c. Hands with palms facing away at shoulder width
d. Repetitions counted aloud by member each time he pulls his chin over bar
e. No swing or bicycle feet movement & must maintain vertical position
f. Test is ended if participate:
i. Removes both hands from bar
ii. Allows either/both feet to touch deck or floor
8) 10 Minute Rest Period
9) 1.5 miles Run:
a. Time limit: 11 minutes 30 seconds, (competitive time: 10 minutes 20 seconds)
b. Wearing full length ODU trousers & boots
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  #68  
Old 2 August 2008, 22:29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fat Guy View Post
This alone demonstrates the checklist mentality of this service. No freedom of maneuver, just go down the checklist. Lots of worthless minutia


CG SEAL Training Application
Physical Fitness Screening Criticalities
Reference: MILPERSMAN 1220-100 Exhibit 1 & OPNAVINST 6110.1F


This is the standard BUD/S PT test for entry.
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  #69  
Old 2 August 2008, 23:02
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Originally Posted by The Fat Guy View Post
My instructor for the Detachment Officers Course (Phase II) was a Recon Marine Major, little guy, became a 2 star I believe. Great leader and instructor. The SF NCO's teased him a bit about his haircut and all but thought he was great.
MAJ Gordon Nash, USMC; as I recall. He took over from CPT S. Anderson, USMC. Both were outstanding SF Officers; pretty good Marines too...
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  #70  
Old 3 August 2008, 01:42
BigZippo BigZippo is offline
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Originally Posted by Sharky View Post
If it doesn't violate OPSEC, post it out here for all of us. If it does violate OPSEC then you shouldn't even be talking about it via PM.


Personally, I'm curious what you have to say. I have a feeling that I know what's coming but I will let you have your say before I open my trap. The floor is yours. Why is this a good idea?
Well I’m not saying this is a good idea, nor am I saying it’s a bad idea. I’m just saying most people don't know about our unit and what the Coast Guard is trying to do. Yes, the CG want s a specialized unit in CT and because the CG is a federal law enforcement entity (Posse Commitatus)it fills a void that DOD can't do because of certain situations (*I am not say that the Teams or other SF units couldn’t do it*) . I have been at this unit for 2 years now. The CG is has been trying for about 4-5 years to have this capability. They have contracted a company (CACI) to train us. We have tried to model our selves after other units in existence. We are battling our own upper echelon and people in the CG on the need for this type of unit. FBI HRT doesn’t want this mission. Not to mention that everyone is stretched thin down range. So far we have taken a small piece of what the Teams do (ship board interdiction). We don’t need the entire land based stuff. We do direct action and hostage rescue among other things. Our SOPs are very similar to the Teams. We have retired Team guys and SF training us. We are still working on getting some of the right equipment i.e. boats and birds, the ones we have work just need some better platforms, which are been addressed as we speak. We are more advanced than alot of people on here give us credit for. We just had an exercise not to long ago (about 2 weeks) where the C.O. from Damneck came to watch. He was impressed with how far along we were in the amount of time we have been doing this mission. We still have a way to go. The guys on my team are all motivated type “A” personalities with a strong desire and commitment to do this job. And yes generally the CG does not have a warrior type personality but there are those in here that do. I personally feel that SF can not be mass produced. There is going to be a clear cut path for us now that there is going to be a LE rating coming on line. The best way to describe the LE rating would be something like the SO rating in the Navy, a clear cut path for advancement. The LE rating will be a way to keep people who have had the training in the same career path and unit for the rest of their career if they choose so. The CG needs help since this is a new mission for them and not a traditionally one (CT). They have done their best, but now have reach out to the Navy for help. I think that the CG is trying to reach this by sending O’s and E’s through BUDS and SQT to become subject experts and come back and set up the CG’ capability properly. My understanding is that if the CG member meets said BUDS entrance requirements the member laterals over to the Navy and can advance in the Navy as an S.O. as said in other posts. If member does not make it he will sent back to the CG. If the member makes it though BUDS and all other pipe line training the member will go operational and then have the choice to reenter the CG. In that time the CG capabilities should still be growing under the DOG (deployable operations group, like what SOCOM is to DOD) and better funded (as every year it has been) to have them come back, tweak it, and make it better. Whether they choose to stay or come back will be a hard one, there is be a definite career path for them either way. We can’t afford to keep re-upping contracts with civilian companies. The CG is setting up the infrastructure to have special operations units. And it will happen. Eventually we will have our own pipeline training. I think this could be a good thing if done right. I understand all the valid points put out there about taking slots away from BUDs and quality of the people being sent to BUDs by us. Let me assure you that the people, who will get chosen, will be at the same “level” as those who are in the Navy now waiting to go to BUDs. I hear you when they say” if he wants to an operator he should have joined the…. and done so”. I dont think people will join the CG to go to BUDs,fail and come back to CG. I think this is a limited thing. The opportunity is here to start our own. I’m an E-6 and 33, to old to apply. I had the opportunity to join the Navy and follow in my dads foot steps but I choose a different path. I kick myself everyday for that. My family has a long history in the special operations community. A lot of you here know my dad, Rich “Doc” Schott and some of the Army folks know my uncle Chris Schott. I have the up most respect for all the BTDT. The CG needs support in this and I ask people to have an open mind. Every special operation unit started from some where and we are asking for help from the subject experts. Please excuse my long winded response and run on paragraphs, I hate typing! I don’t think I violated any OPSEC if so please delete.

Last edited by BigZippo; 3 August 2008 at 01:51.
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  #71  
Old 3 August 2008, 05:42
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BigZippo,

You aren't by chance a GM who was assigned to the MSST in San Pedro back around '02 are you? If you are you know me from the PSU.
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  #72  
Old 3 August 2008, 06:15
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Some Thoughts

Gentlemen-

I don’t even know where to start. First off, thanks in advance for allowing me to post in your house. Typically I’m content with lurking about and keeping my mouth shut, but this topic has the potential to create hate and discontent – by the tone of some of the posts, and the lack of input by coasties (with the exception of BigZippo), I get the feeling that some of my shipmates are feeling bitch-slapped by their Navy brothers from the less than enthusiastic reception of this program. Further, I feel partly responsible for its implementation. As a SME in the Coast Guard’s expeditionary warfare world, I have been hounding senior leadership for nearly a decade to get their operational shit together. This is not quite what I had in mind, but it is what it is, and I hope we can collectively make it work. Before I get in the weeds, I think a little background is in order.

I am a former Recon Marine. I left active duty following my four years, got a sweet job as a Deputy Sheriff in Los Angeles, and put myself through college, Bachelors and Masters, while working full-time and maintaining a reserve commitment in a Marine Corps infantry unit. Upon being activated and deployed in support of the first gulf war, I said fuck it, this is where I belong, and attempted to return to active duty. They said there were no available billets due to downsizing. Roger that, I took my ball and went home.

Having had 12 years in the suck, I thought it was stupid to just throw that time (better than halfway to retirement) away. I started looking. I learned the CG had a small collection of units (primarily reserve) that hooked up with the Navy and did expeditionary warfare. It seemed like a good gig with good guys (lots of former Marines) and a decent mission that pretty much guaranteed a trip to the AO. Sure enough, I’m making my fourth trip to the catbox this fall. Make no mistake, this is not the tip of the spear, more like the shaft, but I’m 42 and still get to play in the game... albeit junior varsity.

Okay, now for the weeds: The Coast Guard has always (as far as I can remember) prided itself, and marketed itself, on being a humanitarian service – “We Save Lives” recruiting campaign, the search and rescue mission, law enforcement operations, the aids to navigation mission, environmental response, ice breaking, etc, etc.

Well, the CG recently had an epiphany and realized they don’t know what they don’t know. Following 911 and the resulting obsession with homeland security, the CG found itself catapulted into the big leagues in terms of its security and law enforcement missions. Yes, the CG has always been tasked with protecting our ports, harbors, waterways, etc, but only recently has this mission become THE priority. Former CG leadership did not take this mission seriously and elected to focus on the more sexy search and rescue “We Save Lives” mission, along with the environmental (duck scrubbing) mission and so forth.

I will further illustrate this point by the following ironic fact: the CG is the only branch of the military specifically tasked with a law enforcement mission; however, it is the only branch of the military that does not have a full-time dedicated law enforcement rate (MOS). That’s right; all law enforcement duties are collateral duties. Consequently, the skill level and professional knowledge of members conducting LE operations suck. Being technically and tactically proficient is a complex and perishable skill. It demands full-time attention.

Furthermore, the CG is finding itself more and more involved in DOD contingency operations (eg. Port Security Units, Naval Coastal Warfare Units, International Training Teams, etc.). While many of those who make up these units are prior service types, such as myself, the majority are inexperienced folks from the “blue” Coast Guard with no concept, or frame of reference, in even the most basic aspects of war fighting. Example: I was unceremoniously, and impromptu, assigned ATFP guy on a certain GOPLAT in the Northern Arabian Gulf that some of you, after having taken it down, handed off to us (circa 2003). I set up my M2s and MK19s and asked my squad leaders for range cards – you would have thought I was speaking Chinese – no clue.

As SOTB pointed out, we do not recruit, or market our service to people with the “snake eater” mindset. We do not teach the warrior ethos in boot camp, and it is certainly not taught in the CG academy. Yea, we blah, blah, blah, about mission accomplishment, but do we really demonstrate what that means in the face of arduous circumstances. I don’t think so. That’s not to say we don’t have some solid, motivated, and highly capable folks. We do. But it’s our institutional philosophy, our culture, which needs to change if we are going to be viable combatants/defenders of the homeland.

This new program, as controversial as it may seem, illustrates a huge change in a seemingly unchangeable bureaucracy. The Coast Guard has finally recognized the tactical, operational, and hopefully (yet it remains to be seen) psychological vacuum that exists among its VBSS/CT/AT/forward deployed units. As BigZippo pointed out, the CG is making tremendous inroads in attempting to get up to speed and rectify the complacency and near-sightedness of the past. Does this mean that CG SEAL program is a good idea? I don’t think so. It seems like a case of good initiative, bad judgment. Time will tell how it all shakes out (assuming it even gets off the ground).

I can tell you this however, should a coastie come before you as a pollywog and make it through training on his own merit, he’ll be as good a brother as you have ever had.

Thank you. I will now pop smoke and unass the AO.
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Old 3 August 2008, 08:48
BigZippo BigZippo is offline
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BigZippo,

You aren't by chance a GM who was assigned to the MSST in San Pedro back around '02 are you? If you are you know me from the PSU.
Yes. Read your profile still can't figure out who you are. LOL:D
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  #74  
Old 3 August 2008, 09:51
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This is the standard BUD/S PT test for entry.
Sorry,

Back in my lane
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  #75  
Old 3 August 2008, 09:57
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MAJ Gordon Nash, USMC; as I recall. He took over from CPT S. Anderson, USMC. Both were outstanding SF Officers; pretty good Marines too...
Tracy,

Exactly, Gordon Nash. I believe he is a two star now. Thanks for the reminder
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Old 3 August 2008, 16:49
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Originally Posted by BigZippo View Post
Well I’m not saying this is a good idea, nor am I saying it’s a bad idea. I’m just saying most people don't know about our unit and what the Coast Guard is trying to do. Yes, the CG want s a specialized unit in CT and because the CG is a federal law enforcement entity (Posse Commitatus)it fills a void that DOD can't do because of certain situations (*I am not say that the Teams or other SF units couldn’t do it*) . I have been at this unit for 2 years now. The CG is has been trying for about 4-5 years to have this capability. They have contracted a company (CACI) to train us. We have tried to model our selves after other units in existence. We are battling our own upper echelon and people in the CG on the need for this type of unit. FBI HRT doesn’t want this mission. Not to mention that everyone is stretched thin down range. So far we have taken a small piece of what the Teams do (ship board interdiction). We don’t need the entire land based stuff. We do direct action and hostage rescue among other things. Our SOPs are very similar to the Teams. We have retired Team guys and SF training us. We are still working on getting some of the right equipment i.e. boats and birds, the ones we have work just need some better platforms, which are been addressed as we speak. We are more advanced than alot of people on here give us credit for. We just had an exercise not to long ago (about 2 weeks) where the C.O. from Damneck came to watch. He was impressed with how far along we were in the amount of time we have been doing this mission. We still have a way to go. The guys on my team are all motivated type “A” personalities with a strong desire and commitment to do this job. And yes generally the CG does not have a warrior type personality but there are those in here that do. I personally feel that SF can not be mass produced. There is going to be a clear cut path for us now that there is going to be a LE rating coming on line. The best way to describe the LE rating would be something like the SO rating in the Navy, a clear cut path for advancement. The LE rating will be a way to keep people who have had the training in the same career path and unit for the rest of their career if they choose so. The CG needs help since this is a new mission for them and not a traditionally one (CT). They have done their best, but now have reach out to the Navy for help. I think that the CG is trying to reach this by sending O’s and E’s through BUDS and SQT to become subject experts and come back and set up the CG’ capability properly. My understanding is that if the CG member meets said BUDS entrance requirements the member laterals over to the Navy and can advance in the Navy as an S.O. as said in other posts. If member does not make it he will sent back to the CG. If the member makes it though BUDS and all other pipe line training the member will go operational and then have the choice to reenter the CG. In that time the CG capabilities should still be growing under the DOG (deployable operations group, like what SOCOM is to DOD) and better funded (as every year it has been) to have them come back, tweak it, and make it better. Whether they choose to stay or come back will be a hard one, there is be a definite career path for them either way. We can’t afford to keep re-upping contracts with civilian companies. The CG is setting up the infrastructure to have special operations units. And it will happen. Eventually we will have our own pipeline training. I think this could be a good thing if done right. I understand all the valid points put out there about taking slots away from BUDs and quality of the people being sent to BUDs by us. Let me assure you that the people, who will get chosen, will be at the same “level” as those who are in the Navy now waiting to go to BUDs. I hear you when they say” if he wants to an operator he should have joined the…. and done so”. I dont think people will join the CG to go to BUDs,fail and come back to CG. I think this is a limited thing. The opportunity is here to start our own. I’m an E-6 and 33, to old to apply. I had the opportunity to join the Navy and follow in my dads foot steps but I choose a different path. I kick myself everyday for that. My family has a long history in the special operations community. A lot of you here know my dad, Rich “Doc” Schott and some of the Army folks know my uncle Chris Schott. I have the up most respect for all the BTDT. The CG needs support in this and I ask people to have an open mind. Every special operation unit started from some where and we are asking for help from the subject experts. Please excuse my long winded response and run on paragraphs, I hate typing! I don’t think I violated any OPSEC if so please delete.



Fair enough, and well said, although the lack of paragraphs kills me. Just hit the enter button twice and keep driving on now and then and all will be well. Tell your uncle Chris I said hello. Good man.
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  #77  
Old 3 August 2008, 17:11
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My fellow professionals,

Sorry it took me so long to find the thread. I just read through all 4 pages. Wow. My creds are in my profile, but to give some background to my perspective, I am on original member of both the USCG's dedicated AT/FP program known as the MSST program (assigned to 91102 as a Physical Security Team Member) and then the USCG's "Special Missions Capability" the Maritime Security Response Team, or MSRT.

Allow me to share an UNCLAS thesis written by Lcdr. Russ Bowen, OpsO to the USCG office of Counter-Terrorism and Special Missions as a teaser. Then after everybody has had a chance to absorb, Id like to give some more perspective.

Take special note to which school he is writing this thesis for.

http://www.cga94.com/docs/Bowen_JSOU_Final.pdf

OOC, out
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  #78  
Old 3 August 2008, 18:29
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First, if my previous posts in this thread came off as anti-Coast Guard than my apologies. I didn't mean any disrepect to that organization or its members.

The author writes that USCG SOF should augment NSW in the same manner CCTs augment SOF units in the field. That statement is completely out of touch. CCTs attached to a SEAL platoon or SF ODA augment that element by acting as a force multiplier. I don't see what this proposed Coast Guard SOF element would bring to the table that a NSWTU doesn't already possess.

That said, he makes valid points for the establishment of a specialized VBSS/MIO unit and if the Coast Guard goes that route, more power too them. I just don't think this element needs to be part of SOCOM. What this unit would stand to gain by sending it's guys through BUD/S I still don't get. I don't want anybody to misunderstand me, I don't mean it in the manner of it's our(SEALs) ball and no one else can play. I just think if you're going to stand up a unit with a specific task than tailor your training to that task.
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  #79  
Old 3 August 2008, 19:07
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just my .02, If a Coastie applies to BUD/S, it should also carry an interservice transfer, meaning if they don't make it through, then they finish their 3 yr obligated service in the Navy, they are always free, after the 3 yrs to go back to the Coast Guard. Bigger incentive to be serious about applying, and if they make it through training, then do two platoons, they most likely would not want to go back to the coast guard.
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Old 3 August 2008, 21:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outofcontrol View Post
My fellow professionals,

Sorry it took me so long to find the thread. I just read through all 4 pages. Wow. My creds are in my profile, but to give some background to my perspective, I am on original member of both the USCG's dedicated AT/FP program known as the MSST program (assigned to 91102 as a Physical Security Team Member) and then the USCG's "Special Missions Capability" the Maritime Security Response Team, or MSRT.

Allow me to share an UNCLAS thesis written by Lcdr. Russ Bowen, OpsO to the USCG office of Counter-Terrorism and Special Missions as a teaser. Then after everybody has had a chance to absorb, Id like to give some more perspective.

Take special note to which school he is writing this thesis for.

http://www.cga94.com/docs/Bowen_JSOU_Final.pdf

OOC, out

Jeeze, it reads like a sci-fi novel, and is about as accurate.


There are so many misconceptions and incorrect assuptions it's laughable.


The author has no concept of who and what NSW does. It's a fantasy script written by someone aboviously not in the know.


I am not against the idea of the USCG having a VBSS ability, far from it. But VBSS is a far cry from being SOF.

If the USCG wants to go to the guys who do the majority of VBSS type raids, it ain't NSW, it's the MAA's in the fleet Navy.
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