SOCNET

Go Back   SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network > General Topics > Weapons

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 14 July 2018, 15:20
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
PDWs

Doing some training w/my PS90 today. Haven't initiated the SBR/suppressor application yet. Maybe, by the end of the year. What do you have as a PDW?

https://youtu.be/jZQZB-bd3Lg

Good shooting
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 14 July 2018, 15:51
gavin's Avatar
gavin gavin is offline
Unemployed Stunt Double
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: On a plane...
Posts: 6,976
Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
What do you have as a PDW?
My 10" 5.56 and 300 BLK SBRs, or my Glock 17s ...I have zero use for a PDW, and can think of few duties where I would need one. I have fired the PS90 and the MP7 quite a bit, and don't see that much utility in either of them. I prefer the MP7 to the PS90.

ETA...can't see much of a point in a PDW that isn't capable of auto fire.
__________________
Life’s barely long enough to get good at one thing. So be careful what you get good at.

Last edited by gavin; 14 July 2018 at 16:13.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 14 July 2018, 16:11
Gsniper Gsniper is offline
Shakin' the bush Boss
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 5,836
Oh, no, not the pelvic girdle.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 14 July 2018, 18:59
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
PDWs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
Oh, no, not the pelvic girdle.
W/the proliferation of: DOD ceramic level III plates on the market & AR500 level III+ plates going for <$100; being, I don't have any M855A1 or M80A1 laying around...the "man-gina" shot has become my primary. Other than, the <10m headshot:)


Thinking, w/this "symmetrical" conflict on the horizon (ie bad guys w/body armor better than ours). I'm thinking, it's going to become much more popular:)


..not to hi-jack my own thread hahaha.


Good shooting
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 14 July 2018, 19:05
275RLTW's Avatar
275RLTW 275RLTW is online now
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: VA
Posts: 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
W/the proliferation of: DOD ceramic level III plates on the market & AR500 level III+ plates going for <$100; being, I don't have any M855A1 or M80A1 laying around...the "man-gina" shot has become my primary. Other than, the <10m headshot:)


Thinking, w/this "symmetrical" conflict on the horizon (ie bad guys w/body armor better than ours). I'm thinking, it's going to become much more popular:)


..not to hi-jack my own thread hahaha.


Good shooting
DoD doesn’t use Level III plates, or the NIJ rating system
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 14 July 2018, 19:12
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
PDWs

Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
My 10" 5.56 and 300 BLK SBRs, or my Glock 17s ...I have zero use for a PDW, and can think of few duties where I would need one. I have fired the PS90 and the MP7 quite a bit, and don't see that much utility in either of them. I prefer the MP7 to the PS90.

ETA...can't see much of a point in a PDW that isn't capable of auto fire.
Honestly, I had my doubts about the 5.7 cartridge. I liked the package, just wasn't sure about the cartridge.

...and, then I got bush wacked/bum rushed by 3 feral hogs along a trail in a thicket. Laid all three out. Butchered them myself & had a 1st hand account of what the cartridge will do.

It is what it is; but, definitely more than I thought. I was impressed.


Good shooting.
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 14 July 2018, 19:17
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
PDWs

Quote:
Originally Posted by 275RLTW View Post
DoD doesn’t use Level III plates, or the NIJ rating system
You got me, SAPI

Good shooting.
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 14 July 2018, 20:33
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
PDWs

Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
Honestly, I had my doubts about the 5.7 cartridge. I liked the package, just wasn't sure about the cartridge.

...and, then I got bush wacked/bum rushed by 3 feral hogs along a trail in a thicket. Laid all three out. Butchered them myself & had a 1st hand account of what the cartridge will do.

It is what it is; but, definitely more than I thought. I was impressed.


Good shooting.
https://youtu.be/ZgbU3P_mtEw

Good shooting
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern

Last edited by glockcqc; 14 July 2018 at 20:34. Reason: attachment
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 15 July 2018, 00:07
ET1/ss nuke's Avatar
ET1/ss nuke ET1/ss nuke is offline
If you don't smell ozone, the radiation won't kill you before next week.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: sc
Posts: 5,861
Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
What do you have as a PDW?
Halitosis, a wedding ring, and a 14 year old vehicle dispense with most of the unwanted attention I would get. I'm too old and broken to outrun or outfight a serious threat, so if a sense of humor and a concealed carry pistol won't handle the situation, I'm sufficiently screwed to make the cost of a PS90 or MP7 better invested in life insurance.
__________________
"I don't know whether the world is run by smart men who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Twain

"I agree that his intentions are suspect, and that he likely needs to die...." - SOTB

"Just a lone patriot acting alone at a fulcrum point, ideally in a deniable fashion. A perpetrator of accidents." - Magician
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 20 July 2018, 03:17
256's Avatar
256 256 is offline
Navigating
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Ohio
Posts: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
My 10" 5.56 and 300 BLK SBRs, or my Glock 17s ...I have zero use for a PDW, and can think of few duties where I would need one. I have fired the PS90 and the MP7 quite a bit, and don't see that much utility in either of them. I prefer the MP7 to the PS90.

ETA...can't see much of a point in a PDW that isn't capable of auto fire.
Are you surprised someone hasn't made an MP7-type of weapon for the civilian market? I tried to get the boss to get them for the SROs, we got the EVOs instead
__________________
Kiowas are small, carrying just two people; they fly so low the two flying soldiers are practically infantrymen.

- Excerpt from Gates of Fire, Michael Yon
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 20 July 2018, 10:50
bobofthedesert's Avatar
bobofthedesert bobofthedesert is offline
RIP SOTB, Cass, Hognose
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Middle of the Mojave
Posts: 4,017
Quote:
Originally Posted by 256 View Post
Are you surprised someone hasn't made an MP7-type of weapon for the civilian market?

I am.

H&K USA could make a mint selling MP7 pistols or better still, factory SBR's. But as usual, just a bunch of excuses as to why they can't do this. The whole MP5 clone industry (with what, 7-8 full time manufacturers) never mind Paki and Turk made imported guns, (they can't keep up with demand) would not exist if H&K had the sense God gave a dog. FN and SIG put the money into US manufacturing facilities decades ago and have profited handsomely, all H&K had to do was follow their lead. But no.....

H&K USA has recently opened a manufacturing facility in Columbus, GA but they have 20+ years of "catch-up" to do. H&K Oberdorf is still run by the same idiots who resisted the SP5K because they "didn't want their guns being used in drive-by's in America", all the while they were busy selling guns to Mexico and The Magic Kingdom™ without the approval and against the express instructions of their own government, for which they are presently having their pee-pee's slapped. Even H&K USA doesn't truly get it, if you'd been there at SHOT when the members of management present were told they could sell 10K semi MP7 pistols/SBR's in America, you could see the lesson of the MP5 clone/import aspects of the market hadn't made a dent on them, they expressed disbelief at that statement even thought they were surrounded by dozens of American "roller-lock" folks who obviously are better in touch with reality than the people running the company.

H&K Oberndorf doesn't really want to be in the business of selling guns to civilians. They prefer selling to government entities, and there's an aspect of resentment of needing the civilian market that runs through their corporate culture. Hence "you suck and we hate you".
__________________
RIP Stevie D. 1964-2012
U.S. Army Veteran of OIF 2003
"Gone But Never Forgotten"

"True love knows the real thing, baby
There's nowhere to hide
It hears every word you never say
And sees through every lie"
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 20 July 2018, 14:11
gavin's Avatar
gavin gavin is offline
Unemployed Stunt Double
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: On a plane...
Posts: 6,976
Quote:
Originally Posted by 256 View Post
Are you surprised someone hasn't made an MP7-type of weapon for the civilian market?
Nope. Concur with Bob. HK doesn’t like private gun ownership. One of the reasons I have zero HK products.
__________________
Life’s barely long enough to get good at one thing. So be careful what you get good at.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 20 July 2018, 20:30
256's Avatar
256 256 is offline
Navigating
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Ohio
Posts: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobofthedesert View Post
I am.

H&K USA could make a mint selling MP7 pistols or better still, factory SBR's. But as usual, just a bunch of excuses as to why they can't do this. The whole MP5 clone industry (with what, 7-8 full time manufacturers) never mind Paki and Turk made imported guns, (they can't keep up with demand) would not exist if H&K had the sense God gave a dog. FN and SIG put the money into US manufacturing facilities decades ago and have profited handsomely, all H&K had to do was follow their lead. But no.....

H&K USA has recently opened a manufacturing facility in Columbus, GA but they have 20+ years of "catch-up" to do. H&K Oberdorf is still run by the same idiots who resisted the SP5K because they "didn't want their guns being used in drive-by's in America", all the while they were busy selling guns to Mexico and The Magic Kingdom™ without the approval and against the express instructions of their own government, for which they are presently having their pee-pee's slapped. Even H&K USA doesn't truly get it, if you'd been there at SHOT when the members of management present were told they could sell 10K semi MP7 pistols/SBR's in America, you could see the lesson of the MP5 clone/import aspects of the market hadn't made a dent on them, they expressed disbelief at that statement even thought they were surrounded by dozens of American "roller-lock" folks who obviously are better in touch with reality than the people running the company.

H&K Oberndorf doesn't really want to be in the business of selling guns to civilians. They prefer selling to government entities, and there's an aspect of resentment of needing the civilian market that runs through their corporate culture. Hence "you suck and we hate you".
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
Nope. Concur with Bob. HK doesn’t like private gun ownership. One of the reasons I have zero HK products.
I’m seriously oversimplifying this but, how hard would it be to make a similar product using the 5.7? Locking bolt-face, small package, throw a pistol “brace” on it and send it to my FFL. Can’t be too difficult to produce. And with all the people that would love to get their hands on an MP7, they’d flock to something similar.

Anyone want to give me a loan!? Lol
__________________
Kiowas are small, carrying just two people; they fly so low the two flying soldiers are practically infantrymen.

- Excerpt from Gates of Fire, Michael Yon

Last edited by 256; 20 July 2018 at 20:44. Reason: Add loan part
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 21 July 2018, 06:35
GPC's Avatar
GPC GPC is offline
Bitter old man.
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: LOFD
Posts: 6,167
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobofthedesert View Post
I am.

H&K USA could make a mint selling MP7 pistols or better still, factory SBR's. But as usual, just a bunch of excuses as to why they can't do this. The whole MP5 clone industry (with what, 7-8 full time manufacturers) never mind Paki and Turk made imported guns, (they can't keep up with demand) would not exist if H&K had the sense God gave a dog. FN and SIG put the money into US manufacturing facilities decades ago and have profited handsomely, all H&K had to do was follow their lead. But no.....

H&K USA has recently opened a manufacturing facility in Columbus, GA but they have 20+ years of "catch-up" to do. H&K Oberdorf is still run by the same idiots who resisted the SP5K because they "didn't want their guns being used in drive-by's in America", all the while they were busy selling guns to Mexico and The Magic Kingdom™ without the approval and against the express instructions of their own government, for which they are presently having their pee-pee's slapped. Even H&K USA doesn't truly get it, if you'd been there at SHOT when the members of management present were told they could sell 10K semi MP7 pistols/SBR's in America, you could see the lesson of the MP5 clone/import aspects of the market hadn't made a dent on them, they expressed disbelief at that statement even thought they were surrounded by dozens of American "roller-lock" folks who obviously are better in touch with reality than the people running the company.

H&K Oberndorf doesn't really want to be in the business of selling guns to civilians. They prefer selling to government entities, and there's an aspect of resentment of needing the civilian market that runs through their corporate culture. Hence "you suck and we hate you".
You can only rely on reputation/cult following for so long. With the failure of the G36 you figure they would make MP7s here in America to skirt German law. I was CEO that would happen very quickly. I'd sell them at a loss then jack the price up later. Same with UMP pistols etc. And I would put the P7 back in production.
__________________
Steel Rain Brings The Pain!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 21 July 2018, 07:30
Silverbullet's Avatar
Silverbullet Silverbullet is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Bunker
Posts: 15,126
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
Nope. Concur with Bob. HK doesn’t like private gun ownership. One of the reasons I have zero HK products.
Concur.
I won't purchase any of their stuff either.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 21 July 2018, 11:49
Tuukka's Avatar
Tuukka Tuukka is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Finland
Posts: 1,047
Well the German government will not allow HK or any other German manufacturer to sell "weapons of war"

But even in Germany and any other European country that allows, the MR series rifles are very close to 416/417 and even short barreled variants are available. Plus the new semi auto MP5K civilian variants etc
__________________
RECON - Always a step ahead

Last edited by Tuukka; 21 July 2018 at 12:15.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 21 July 2018, 12:00
gavin's Avatar
gavin gavin is offline
Unemployed Stunt Double
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: On a plane...
Posts: 6,976
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuukka View Post
Well the German government will not allow HK or any other German manufacturer to sell "weapons of war"
HK has an undeniable history of being against civilian ownership of their products, based on written documents coming from principals in the company. It is not a stretch to infer that they only sell weapons to commercial markets because, well, they have to in order to turn a profit.

They could quite easily structure a US subsidiary to manufacture and sell any sort of weapon legal in the United States, and the German government would not be involved.

Getting back to the original topic, glockcqc has rekindled my interest in FN PDWs...damn him...
__________________
Life’s barely long enough to get good at one thing. So be careful what you get good at.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 21 July 2018, 13:51
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is online now
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 11,978
^yeah, the PS90 is a pretty cool weapon system. Fun to shoot, reliable, accurate and ergonomic.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 22 July 2018, 21:25
glockcqc glockcqc is offline
BTDT
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 1,066
Quote:
Originally Posted by ET1/ss nuke View Post
Halitosis, a wedding ring, and a 14 year old vehicle dispense with most of the unwanted attention I would get. I'm too old and broken to outrun or outfight a serious threat, so if a sense of humor and a concealed carry pistol won't handle the situation, I'm sufficiently screwed to make the cost of a PS90 or MP7 better invested in life insurance.
What a bit of human honesty
...don't see much of that on the internet.

Well, I got a pretty good price; though, sense of humor is priceless.

Cheers.
__________________
"By trial and error and correction do we learn - not by theory and arguement." Ed McGivern
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 23 July 2018, 07:53
steve steve is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 638
Quote:
Originally Posted by 256 View Post
I’m seriously oversimplifying this but, how hard would it be to make a similar product using the 5.7? Locking bolt-face, small package, throw a pistol “brace” on it and send it to my FFL. Can’t be too difficult to produce. And with all the people that would love to get their hands on an MP7, they’d flock to something similar.

Anyone want to give me a loan!? Lol
Keltec already makes the PMR30 in .22mag, maybe the could be convinced to produce it in another caliber.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Our new posting rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:58.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Socnet.com All Rights Reserved
© SOCNET 1996-2018