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  #41  
Old 27 July 2018, 09:59
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Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
The 5.7 cartridge, fired from the PS90? I was initially skeptical myself. But, I've harvested a total of 5 feral hogs w/it. Every hog I engaged perished. Two of them, where in complete darkness, w/the aid of a green light. All of them harvested w/the SS197 round (ie 40gr .223 ballistic tip bullet).

What I would like to see, produced commercially, is a Barnes TSX bullet 5.7 round. If it's already out there, I'm unaware of it.

I believe it is already in the system for the 4.6, & is being utilized w/great success.


Good shooting
Cool information. I’m almost ready to donate the money to my PD to get an MP7. I thought practice ammunition would be priced way over the top, it’s really not that bad. Duty ammunition I haven’t looked at tho.
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  #42  
Old 27 July 2018, 12:02
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Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post

What I would like to see, produced commercially, is a Barnes TSX bullet 5.7 round. If it's already out there, I'm unaware of it.
No major manufacturers are doing this yet that I am aware of.. but there are a few small shops making commercial ammo with the barnes TSX in 5.7 (I am a huge fan of barnes BTW.. I have yet to find anything else with the same quality of terminal performance across such a wide range of calibers/impact velocities/etc.. the TSX and TTSX are about all I shoot anymore in both hunting and home defense rifles..)..

http://www.vanguardoutfittersllc.com/ammo/handgun-ammunition/custom-load-57x28-barnes-tsx-45-grain-1476
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  #43  
Old 27 July 2018, 12:50
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Seems like someone could rechamber the B&T TP9 in 4.6x30mm and have a winner that's close enough to the ergos of a MP7 to get a shitload of civvie buys. But I don't know enough about that kind of stuff to say with any confidence how 'easy' it would be. But I do know I want me a TP9......

TP9:

MP7:
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  #44  
Old 28 July 2018, 07:53
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Originally Posted by mdwest View Post
No major manufacturers are doing this yet that I am aware of.. but there are a few small shops making commercial ammo with the barnes TSX in 5.7 (I am a huge fan of barnes BTW.. I have yet to find anything else with the same quality of terminal performance across such a wide range of calibers/impact velocities/etc.. the TSX and TTSX are about all I shoot anymore in both hunting and home defense rifles..)..

http://www.vanguardoutfittersllc.com/ammo/handgun-ammunition/custom-load-57x28-barnes-tsx-45-grain-1476

Visited their Site. Saw the 50gr TSX (ie not the 45gr)..and, they're claiming a muzzle velocity of 2300+, from a PS90? Rather skeptical of that claim:)

..Barnes would need to get involved w/someone like Blackhills & have/design a 35-40gr TSX that performs best @ around 2000-2200 fps-ish. Not, @ 5.56 or 22-250 velocities:)


If you choose to talk apples & apples; which, I don't know,..rarely happens on the internet:) The 9mm/5.7/4.7 "can" have very similar terminal ballistics (ie bullet design specific). Really, when comparing the cartridges, the biggest savings...is weight & compactness of the 5.7/4.6 cartridges.


I do find it "funny", that USPSA has chosen not to except either cartridge in PCC. Most probably, because EVERYONE would immediately drop the 9mm & transition to 5.7 or 4.6:)


Good shooting
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  #45  
Old 28 July 2018, 08:33
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Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post
A Glock 17 makes a good PDW.
Yep buy one of those Roni kits there you go PDW. They are all the rage with tactical fan boys. I believe there are knock-offs that are available from FAB defense.
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  #46  
Old 28 July 2018, 14:16
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Originally Posted by glockcqc View Post
Visited their Site. Saw the 50gr TSX (ie not the 45gr)..and, they're claiming a muzzle velocity of 2300+, from a PS90? Rather skeptical of that claim:)

..Barnes would need to get involved w/someone like Blackhills & have/design a 35-40gr TSX that performs best @ around 2000-2200 fps-ish. Not, @ 5.56 or 22-250 velocities:)


If you choose to talk apples & apples; which, I don't know,..rarely happens on the internet:) The 9mm/5.7/4.7 "can" have very similar terminal ballistics (ie bullet design specific). Really, when comparing the cartridges, the biggest savings...is weight & compactness of the 5.7/4.6 cartridges.


I do find it "funny", that USPSA has chosen not to except either cartridge in PCC. Most probably, because EVERYONE would immediately drop the 9mm & transition to 5.7 or 4.6:)


Good shooting
Underwood sure makes some agressive 9mm ammunition. Would you worry about the lack of good bullet coefficients with 9mm projectiles? But then again, how far are you engaging with a 4.6/5.7? Would it be SOP to bring the MP7 on mission and also bring a larger caliber platform (5.56/7.62)?

I was pretty surprised at the MP7 price from Arms Unlimited. Look it up anywhere else and they are 3200 bucks..
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  #47  
Old 28 July 2018, 14:46
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When comparing platforms and chamberings, etc, keep the purpose of a PDW in mind. I would never choose a PDW if I can get away with carrying a rifle or carbine. For US civilian LE use, I can envision very few scenarios or duties in which a PDW would be better than a carbine, and none of those involve uniformed patrol or SWAT. A PDW is inferior to a carbine or rifle in just about every way (save the scenario I mentioned before in this thread).
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  #48  
Old 28 July 2018, 15:51
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Originally Posted by 256 View Post
Cool information. I’m almost ready to donate the money to my PD to get an MP7. I thought practice ammunition would be priced way over the top, it’s really not that bad. Duty ammunition I haven’t looked at tho.
What would you use it for? As gavin stated, I can’t imagine a whole lot of uses for it, especially in LE.

I know our firearms section humored the idea momentarily for the motors guys. In the end, they found some SBRs we a collapsable stock that fits in the saddle bag.
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  #49  
Old 28 July 2018, 16:13
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Ive been observing this thread with amusement.

I recall the Shoulder-mounted 9mm being in vogue back in the 90's.
Then the shotgun taking a back-seat to bad guys wearing body armor ...
Then the "Is it a carbine or a rifle?" debate. The answer: "Patrol Rife'.

I was waiting - and gavin finally posted something of sage relevance.

If you want one of these 'PDW's for whatever reason - fine. I get it. However, if one is going to shoot for blood, that shoulder mounted weapon best be chambered in a rifle caliber and CARTRIDGE rather anything less.
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  #50  
Old 28 July 2018, 16:40
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Once upon a time I carried a MAC 10 or MP5K while in indigenous cars blending in with the populace. They were fantastic guns when used inside the confines where you cannot get full, or near full, arm extension. Strictly PDWs (before there were called PDWs). Even when suppressed and with a buttstock the MAC10 is wanting.

I always preferred (objective dependent) on using a 1. M4 or 2. MP5SD.

If you are going to a gunfight, bring the biggest gun you have to have the biggest impact at the greatest reasonable distance.
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  #51  
Old 28 July 2018, 17:08
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Quote:
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I was pretty surprised at the MP7 price from Arms Unlimited. Look it up anywhere else and they are 3200 bucks..
1) Older MP7A1 variant.
2) They don't actually have them in stock, they merely take the
order and the gun drops ships direct to the agency from
H&K USA.
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  #52  
Old 28 July 2018, 19:40
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My thought process was taking that instead of an AR for use while getting into position, my MR762 in a pack on my back. In 2012 one of our snipers was getting into position an ran into the armed subject in the “secured” back yard. He was in CQB range, and used his M4, good ending for sniper. More than anything, it would be a neat weapon to play with and for 1800 I might entertain the thought of donating to the PD for it.

Understood on the ordering process. We’re still waiting on a few of the donated 416s to arrive. More than anything I’m just surprised no one has made a rip-off of it for civilian use.
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  #53  
Old 28 July 2018, 20:00
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My thought process was taking that instead of an AR for use while getting into position, my MR762 in a pack on my back. In 2012 one of our snipers was getting into position an ran into the armed subject in the “secured” back yard. He was in CQB range, and used his M4, good ending for sniper. More than anything, it would be a neat weapon to play with and for 1800 I might entertain the thought of donating to the PD for it.

Understood on the ordering process. We’re still waiting on a few of the donated 416s to arrive. More than anything I’m just surprised no one has made a rip-off of it for civilian use.
416/417s. Rough life
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  #54  
Old 28 July 2018, 20:05
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416/417s. Rough life
Lol, let's not forget when BARs and Tommy Guns we're the in thing for LE.
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  #55  
Old 28 July 2018, 20:08
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Lol, let's not forget when BARs and Tommy Guns we're the in thing for LE.
We haves some Thompson’s in the armory..... and they may have smoked some famous criminals.
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  #56  
Old 28 July 2018, 20:14
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We haves some Thompson’s in the armory..... and they may have smoked some famous criminals.
Tape a light to them and hit the streets.
Hoodrats would shit a Twinkie you step out of a cruiser with one.

Shame they are just sitting there.
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  #57  
Old 28 July 2018, 21:22
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Tape a light to them and hit the streets.
Hoodrats would shit a Twinkie you step out of a cruiser with one.

Shame they are just sitting there.


Hahahahaha tell me about it
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  #58  
Old 28 July 2018, 21:48
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Originally Posted by Whitebean54 View Post
416/417s. Rough life
White-people problems..
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  #59  
Old 29 July 2018, 21:39
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I am still using a DGI 5.56 with a 10.5” barrel; very interested in new projectiles for 50yds in, such as hornady critical duty 5.56. Has anyone here tested it?
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  #60  
Old 29 July 2018, 22:03
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I am still using a DGI 5.56 with a 10.5” barrel; very interested in new projectiles for 50yds in, such as hornady critical duty 5.56. Has anyone here tested it?
Hornady TAP 5.56 SBR is what you seek...best round for SBRs. They make both training and duty loadings.
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