Go Back   SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network > General Topics > The Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 1 May 2005, 17:47
SgtSki SgtSki is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: USA - New Jersey
Posts: 35
Who provides close protection for Commanding Generals?

Hope you guys don't beat me up too much - as a Former Marine and EP type I should already know this! I tried the search engine as well as Google with no luck!

I was TV channel surfing on the Discovery or military channel last week ( I can't remember which) and they were doing a story on General Schwarzkopf ... (whose father, by the way, founded my beloved State Police outfit).
Anyway, there were a couple scenes of the General overseas during the first Gulf War and I notice these guys surrounding him are wearing civilian & pseudo-military gear (i.e. 5.11 Royal Robbins vests, Oakley's, etc and armed with M-4's) and I began wondering what unit provides executive protection for the Commanding General?!?
Does anyone know what unit is tasked with close protection? Is it SF or is there a particular MOS that provides executive protection full time, or is it just when the Commander is overseas in harms way.

Likewise, who performs this function in the Marine Corps? I was an MSG prior to the beginning of the DSS and we did our fair share of EP escorts, however, do Generals have their own details? I would have loved to have done that!

Anyway, if anyone knows - don't hesitate to reach out, thanks! SgtSki
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 1 May 2005, 17:55
Para Para is offline
I just happen to be a superhero
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Ft Bragg
Posts: 393
I would venture to guess that is a boarderline OPSEC question.
__________________
We have before us an ordeal of the most grievous kind. We have before us many, many long months of struggle and of suffering. You ask what is our policy? I will say: It is to wage war, by sea, land, and air with all our might and all our strength that God can give us; to wage war against a monstrous tyranny, never surpassed in the dark, lamentable catalogue of human crime. That is our policy. You ask, What is our aim? I answer in one word: Victory Victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror, victory, however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, there is no survival. Winston Churchill
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 1 May 2005, 18:03
SgtSki SgtSki is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: USA - New Jersey
Posts: 35
I'm not asking for an OpSec answer!

I'm not asking who specifically is working in that field - I just want to know if that is a unit or MOS or if SF handles close protection. It's not like I'm asking a secret .... they are not invisible, when you look at the General, it's easy to see that they are there protecting him! I just want to know if anyone has any general info about a field I find very interesting! Or at least point me in the right direction to research the topic further. Thanks, Sgt Ski

Last edited by SgtSki; 1 May 2005 at 18:11.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 1 May 2005, 18:16
mara mara is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: CONUS
Posts: 1,037
I think the answer is, "it depends."

I think, but am not certain, that there is an MP MOS that has PSD responsibility. Downrange many of the military PSD were not MPs.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 1 May 2005, 18:20
sureshot03 sureshot03 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: POST ONE
Posts: 39
pm

pm inbound
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 1 May 2005, 18:26
Sdiver Sdiver is offline
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Where COORS Beer is made
Posts: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by mara
I think the answer is, "it depends."

I think, but am not certain, that there is an MP MOS that has PSD responsibility. Downrange many of the military PSD were not MPs.
I do think it is MPs. The Brigade commander (B.G.) for the Brigade I was with in Germany, pulled his detail from the various MP Co's under his command. One of my roommates got an interview and was later assigned to his detail.

Don't really know about 4 stars. They must pull people, from units under them.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 1 May 2005, 19:39
Bearcat06 Bearcat06 is offline
On the Extract Bird
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Hickam Field
Posts: 936
In the past it's either CID Agents or MPs that get pulled because they have the ASI of V5 (MP Investigations). We lost guys from our line units from time-to-time to go TDY at the needs of the Army on 90-120 missions to do stuff like this because they had the PSD training....which is including in the MPI School (the Army runs a separate school as well for other services and MPs that haven't had MPI School).
If they are assigned to the Pentagon, the Pentagon Police has their own guys doing it but CID assists as needed.
Though, I worked with a guy in Saudi that was an 11B and got pulled to drive his BDE CDR and stayed with him when he made his first star. He got to go to the PSD School and Driving School at Leonard Wood and stayed with him after he got his second star.
With the GWOT going on, I am sure they are pulling people from all over to cover the spots.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 1 May 2005, 19:56
sureshot03 sureshot03 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: POST ONE
Posts: 39
there was a posting on here a while ago about the corps putting together a dedicated close protection platoon from reserve 03's i believe. ive done this twice on msg duty and i dont see what the hype is with military psd. i did it in bogota and being an 03-the general rule of thumb is that large crowds draw fire
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 2 May 2005, 03:36
shark11 shark11 is offline
Authorized Personnel
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South Florida
Posts: 360
I think the basic answer here is it really depends. I know that certain generals get a dedicated PSD when they are in theater, while others might just have a driver who is on a temportary assignment. I know that the CENTCOM CG general has some D-Boys when he is in theater. It really depends on the threat assessment of the protectee, and where he is going.

I think the last time a General was succesfully targeted was back in the 80's with Gereral Dozier, I believe he was the subject of a few attempts.

As far as OPSEC, there is nothing on this thread that you cant find out in open source information.
__________________
Be polite, be professional, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

Last edited by shark11; 2 May 2005 at 03:41. Reason: adding
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 2 May 2005, 05:24
TPD1280's Avatar
TPD1280 TPD1280 is offline
SOCNET Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Little House on the Pasture
Posts: 5,038
Roughly the same time as Dozier, was the attack on GEN Kroesen, then CINC USAREUR. RPG round to the truck of the car. It did penetrate the passenger compartment, but fortunately did not detonate. After those two attacks, PSD received more serious consideration throughout USAREUR.

GEN Glen K. Otis viewed his PSD as a necessary evil, and treated them with respect, even though he didn't like having babysitters.

GEN Crosbie Saint viewed his PSD with contempt. Nothing more than the trappings of his rank and power. He did not want to see them around, but the had better be around. Mrs. Saint used hers to get her dry cleaning.

My cousin just got back from Kosovo, where he was working PSD for a General Officer. He did the same thing in Bosnia. Joe is an MP who has attended PSD school.

My patrol Sergeant at KCSO, is a Reserve CID Warrant Officer. He was mobilized and has been working PSD missions for the duration of his activation.

I got my training while attending MPI School, and have worked details for General Officers, SecDef, and SecArmy, and various other dignitaries.

The fact that MP's and USACIDC SA's work PSD missions is not classified, nor is it OPSEC. It is open source and is in the MOS job description.

Specifics regarding Tactics, Techniques, and Practices would be.
__________________
Government is an unregulated industry.

The 4 Soldierly Values: Candor, Courage, Competence, Commitment

Ekky Ekky Ekky Ekky p-Tang Zoo Boing mumble, mumble
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 2 May 2005, 05:47
mdb23's Avatar
mdb23 mdb23 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,993
Disregard.
__________________
"Everybody thinks himself so well supplied with common sense that even those most difficult to please...never desire more of it than they already have." Rene Descartes
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 2 May 2005, 06:57
TPD1280's Avatar
TPD1280 TPD1280 is offline
SOCNET Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Little House on the Pasture
Posts: 5,038
Link to a page about the NOCS, the Italian CT/HR Team that rescued BG Dozier in 1982 from the Red Brigade without firing a shot.

http://students.engr.scu.edu/~jabrah...ocs/page4.html

The attack on Gen. Kroesen took place in 1981.
__________________
Government is an unregulated industry.

The 4 Soldierly Values: Candor, Courage, Competence, Commitment

Ekky Ekky Ekky Ekky p-Tang Zoo Boing mumble, mumble
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 2 May 2005, 13:46
KKG
Visitor
 
Posts: n/a
Who is PSD(personal suck dicks) for commanding generals?

Soldiers that cannot secure a real job :D

Last edited by KKG; 2 May 2005 at 13:58.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 2 May 2005, 22:30
Spinner's Avatar
Spinner Spinner is offline
Pele's Bucket of Fire?...never heard of it
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 12,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by mara
I think the answer is, "it depends."

I think, but am not certain, that there is an MP MOS that has PSD responsibility. Downrange many of the military PSD were not MPs.
For our Division Commander, in the field at least, the responsibility fell to the MPs. Back in garrison...that's something I won't go into.
__________________
"This is supposed to be a happy occasion! Let's not bicker and argue over who killed who!"
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 2 May 2005, 22:43
SOTB's Avatar
SOTB SOTB is offline
Minus one, but more symmetrical....
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Clorox'ing the gene pool....
Posts: 33,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by TPD1280
Roughly the same time as Dozier, was the attack on GEN Kroesen, then CINC USAREUR. RPG round to the truck of the car. It did penetrate the passenger compartment, but fortunately did not detonate.
Umm, actually, there were two RPG rounds fired. One hit the street and bounced off without exploding (I think) and the other struck the trunk area BEHIND the passenger compartment. And the round did not penetrate. The attack was followed up by small-arms fire. None of those rounds penetrated the armor of the limo. The MPs (at least one of them) reportedly fired back at the hillside with his .45.

At least one of the attackers was later captured (they had rappelled down into the site and stayed there for some time period -- I can no longer remember for how long). Reportedly the driver of the limo, an old German dude, kinda spazzed out and did nothing during the attack (hence the limo still there for the small arms fire). The General's aide took over, started the car, and moved the limo out.

I have pics of this somewhere (one of the advantages of being a FAG instructor from the early INTAC/AIQC days)....
__________________
Losing faith in humanity, one assclown at a time....
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 2 May 2005, 22:45
Spinner's Avatar
Spinner Spinner is offline
Pele's Bucket of Fire?...never heard of it
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 12,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by TPD1280
Mrs. Saint used hers to get her dry cleaning.
And if anything were to happen to somebody while the security detail was performing non-essential tasks (carrying groceries, walking the doggie, etc...)We all know who would have their ass handed to them.

Occasionally, the tables get turned. Alice Sessions comes to mind.

http://www-tech.mit.edu/V112/N66/sessions.66w.html
__________________
"This is supposed to be a happy occasion! Let's not bicker and argue over who killed who!"
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 3 May 2005, 01:11
sureshot03 sureshot03 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: POST ONE
Posts: 39
i heard a good story from one of the guys on xpotus jimmy carters detail when he was down here. this guy was a shift leader on hillary clinton's detail and he wasnt shy about his feelings towards her. apparently, she's one of the least favorite principles in ss history. during a shopping trip-she asked an agent to hold her coat and one of her bags and when he explained to her that it was interfering with his whole reason for being there-she demanded that he be replaced immeaditely. then the shift leader-the guy that told me the story, explained to her with the utmost tact that they were solely there to protect her. apparently, there were 7 total agents that were either removed from her detail or threated resignation if they wernt reassigned. interesting stuff-it must make the job hard when the principle either hates security or doesnt understand what it entails.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 3 May 2005, 04:54
TPD1280's Avatar
TPD1280 TPD1280 is offline
SOCNET Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Little House on the Pasture
Posts: 5,038
Quote:
Who is PSD(personal suck dicks) for commanding generals?
Quote:
Soldiers that cannot secure a real job
Originally posted by KKG

Did you really say that and think it would go unnoticed or be thought of as funny or cool? Even the smilie didn't mitigate that one.

Do tell me more. I can't wait to hear from a self-described member of a "geriatric fat bastard guard unit" (quoted from your profile) on how willingly placing yourself in front of a Principal, and taking the hurt/hate/embarassment for him is not a real job.

But first, let me ask a couple of others to join this discussion. I'm sure some of the guys who frequent these boards who are currently facing hostile fire on a daily basis while doing what you consider to be "not a real job" will have very interesting thoughts on the matter.

I see you edited this post once, try again slick.
__________________
Government is an unregulated industry.

The 4 Soldierly Values: Candor, Courage, Competence, Commitment

Ekky Ekky Ekky Ekky p-Tang Zoo Boing mumble, mumble

Last edited by TPD1280; 3 May 2005 at 07:36.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 3 May 2005, 10:27
equillian equillian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Lonestar State
Posts: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sdiver
I do think it is MPs. The Brigade commander (B.G.) for the Brigade I was with in Germany, pulled his detail from the various MP Co's under his command. One of my roommates got an interview and was later assigned to his detail.

Don't really know about 4 stars. They must pull people, from units under them.
Sorry to barge in, however, I can contribute to this topic.

Sdiver is right on the money. During the mid-80's I came from a 'jack-of-all' trades MP company and was 'recruited' to work PSD for a LTG. My PSD career started with me walking security outside the Principle's quarters, then moving to uniformed detail and then finally 'close-protection'.

At the time, our threat was primarily the RAF(Red Army Faction).


equillian
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 3 May 2005, 11:56
Guy's Avatar
Guy Guy is offline
#AllLionsMatter
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CONUS @ the moment
Posts: 12,988
Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by KKG
Soldiers that cannot secure a real job :D
I would highly suggest that, you shut your trap! Especially since you have never did it.

Stay safe.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8654maine

There is a limit to compassion.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Our new posting rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 21:03.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Socnet.com All Rights Reserved
SOCNET