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Old 13 May 2019, 08:52
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July 2018 Anaheim Axon Vid

Anyone see this vid of a 2 man car going after a "man with a gun acting erratically" ? Holy sweet jesus.

YouTube>Active Self Protection Channel.

Guest commentary from a Kansas swat cop.
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On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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Old 13 May 2019, 10:49
WGH0922 WGH0922 is offline
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My daughter and her man friend came down yesterday and he asked me if I heard about this incident, which I hadn't. He gave me the 5 W's and said that while their initial reaction to use deadly force was correct, everything thereafter was a shit show. Here's a link.

https://www.ocregister.com/2019/05/0...-neighborhood/
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Old 13 May 2019, 11:58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
Guest commentary from a Kansas swat cop.
Chuck is someone I highly respect in the LEO/use of force world. He's a solid trainer and expert at his craft. His perspective is always worth paying attention to.
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Old 13 May 2019, 12:38
dustyrebel dustyrebel is offline
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That's probably the second or third video I've seen this year with officers shooting through their own windshield.....is this a new thing that's being taught? Serious question.
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Old 13 May 2019, 12:40
Mars Mars is offline
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I have a friend that is alive today because he put some well-aimed shots into the bad guy through his own windshield. It has applications and will continue to come up when dealing with thugs. Whether or not it is being routinely being *taught* -- I don't know, but it should be addressed because it does happen.
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Old 13 May 2019, 14:55
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I'd say it's taught in a counter ambush sense more than this kind of thing. Guys have done it successfully. One of my buddies did it while pursuing a guy who was firing a shotgun at him (took at least one pellet to the vest). The dude was so riddled with bullets at the end I don't even know if an attempt was made to figure out who hit him when. I always wear eye protection at work and that's one reason why. I'd hate to fire a weapon inside a cruiser though.
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Old 13 May 2019, 15:55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massgrunt View Post
I'd say it's taught in a counter ambush sense more than this kind of thing.

Yep. This technique (to my knowledge) originated in training for counter-ambush situations in higher risk OCONUS areas.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Massgrunt View Post
I'd hate to fire a weapon inside a cruiser though.

That is no shit. Probably permanent damage.
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Old 13 May 2019, 18:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massgrunt View Post
I always wear eye protection at work and that's one reason why. I'd hate to fire a weapon inside a cruiser though.
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Originally Posted by Sharky View Post
That is no shit. Probably permanent damage.
Just wear ear pro for your entire shift...just in case.
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Old 13 May 2019, 18:51
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Just wear ear pro for your entire shift...just in case.
I keep ears on the passenger seat.
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Old 13 May 2019, 21:24
Dino0311 Dino0311 is offline
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I keep hearing protection with me but not accessible while driving. But having a lot of hearing loss already is a definite advantage lol
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Old 14 May 2019, 09:24
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From a previous thread on this (I think Sharky said it? Vegas chase?), apparently (like that Kansas guy said) - at 'hood ornament' distance it can work - or if you make a hole that they can sail thorough unmolested. But due to angle of glass, in to out deflects up, and out to in deflects down. In this case, I'd be more concerned with the 67 rounds that didn't connect, bouncing around Anaheim. Driver got fired.

I don't recall any "perceived" hearing damage from firing the SAW out of the Trail Vehicle (Lexan "Camper Top") or out of the front navigator seat - never remember any ringing? Maybe it damaged my memory too. Does Auditory Exclusion actually prevent damage?
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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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Old 14 May 2019, 09:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
Does Auditory Exclusion actually prevent damage?
Umm...no.

There's no such thing as "perceived hearing damage." Sort of like "perceived death" or "perceived pregnancy."
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Old 14 May 2019, 09:40
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Originally Posted by gavin View Post
Umm...no.

There's no such thing as "perceived hearing damage." Sort of like "perceived death" or "perceived pregnancy."

If I shoot, and my ears aren't ringing, and I can hear fine - that's the perception I'm talking about. "Briefness" may have played a part too - I accept there was damage none the less.
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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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  #14  
Old 14 May 2019, 10:16
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
If I shoot, and my ears aren't ringing, and I can hear fine - that's the perception I'm talking about. "Briefness" may have played a part too - I accept there was damage none the less.
If you torched off a M249 in enclosed space without hearing pro, even a single round, you've likely got some permanent hearing loss. If you made a habit of it, you likely have substantial hearing loss.

Kinda like me...bothers me that everyone mumbles these days, and that manufacturers only make blurry sights for weapons...but there's nothing wrong with my hearing or vision.
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Old 14 May 2019, 10:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Believeraz View Post
Chuck is someone I highly respect in the LEO/use of force world. He's a solid trainer and expert at his craft. His perspective is always worth paying attention to.
Chuck is good friend of mine. Solid dude with a good perspective. He did a single officer response to active shooter class for us last year. Good shit.
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Old 14 May 2019, 10:42
Dino0311 Dino0311 is offline
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I've fired rifles and SAWs out of a pickup truck with no hearing protection on but all the windows were open except for probably the driver's. Still a terrible idea but not as bad as all the windows closed and firing within the vehicle.
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Old 14 May 2019, 12:55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massgrunt View Post
I've fired rifles and SAWs out of a pickup truck with no hearing protection on but all the windows were open except for probably the driver's. Still a terrible idea but not as bad as all the windows closed and firing within the vehicle.
Yup, same trucks probably. SAW muzzle was over the Tailgate, outside in the wind, as was the rifle's from the front seat. All windows open except for Tommy's or Steve's. I swear - I don't remember any "ringing" (We did wear ear-pro though, when we practiced at the range on Arlington).

I do have damage (Tinnitus), but that started in '86. That cop firing that pistol though - yeah, bet that was loud AF.
__________________
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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  #18  
Old 14 May 2019, 13:21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massgrunt View Post
I've fired rifles and SAWs out of a pickup truck with no hearing protection on but all the windows were open except for probably the driver's. Still a terrible idea but not as bad as all the windows closed and firing within the vehicle.
A much more terrible idea would have been not returning fire.
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  #19  
Old 14 May 2019, 13:32
bobmueller bobmueller is offline
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Oklahoma HP had a case a while back, pursuing a double murder suspect who'd also shot two cops. They had air support verifying that the road ahead was empty. The pursuing trooper made the decision to fire his carbine through the windshield. He had the gun braced at the corner of the windshield and dash and put about 50 rounds out. I don't know that he actually hit the guy, but he got the truck stopped, and they engaged him there and killed him. But that was a lonely county road out west of BFE, Oklahoma, not a residential neighborhood.
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Old 14 May 2019, 18:46
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Originally Posted by bobmueller View Post
Oklahoma HP had a case a while back, pursuing a double murder suspect who'd also shot two cops. They had air support verifying that the road ahead was empty. The pursuing TROOPER made the decision to fire his carbine through the windshield. He had the gun braced at the corner of the windshield and dash and put about 50 rounds out. I don't know that he actually hit the guy, but he got the truck stopped, and they engaged him there and killed him. But that was a lonely county road out west of BFE, Oklahoma, not a residential neighborhood.
Fixed it for you

On a serious note, he did connect with the guy several times. IIRC, Suspect got out and either the truck was in neutral/reverse and was trying to use it as cover. The calvary showed up and someone popped him with a string of full auto(yeah yeah yeah I know) well he was out of the vehicle.

It’s been some time since I’ve seen the video but he was Trooper if the Year at some point since.
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