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  #81  
Old 29 December 2014, 21:17
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Lightbulb Teach Sexual Consent to Kindergartners?

Nothing to see here but your average freak California college student wanting to teach your young children about sexual consent....... OMG.

http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=6168&app=cro

Student activists demand California teach sexual consent to kindergartners

-California college students are demanding that consensual sex education be taught in grades K-12.

-The activists presented a list of three demands to help curtail campus rapes.

-The students also want more transparency in colleges' investigations into campus sexual assault and mandatory consent classes in college.

Student activists at California colleges are demanding children as young as kindergarten-age be taught consent education in order to curtail campus sexual assault.

According to a list of three demands from students at University of California, Berkeley; University of California, Santa Barbara; and San Diego State University, the state of California should teach sexual consent to K-12 students.

“We recommend consent education in K12. College is too late for people to learn about bodily autonomy and respect." Tweet This

“We recommend consent education in K12 [sic]. College is too late for people to learn about bodily autonomy and respect,” the request states.

According to Alejandra Melgoza, Take Back the Night coordinator at UC Santa Barbara, consent education would include teaching students to keep their hands to themselves.

“Concerned parents might think we’re talking about consent in a purely sexual context, when really we’re talking on a day-to-day basis,” Melgoza told The Huffington Post

Rest of article at above link.
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  #82  
Old 29 December 2014, 21:41
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Damn... that's got to be some killer bud out there.
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  #83  
Old 29 December 2014, 22:40
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Reads like a deliberately misleading opinion piece from another "all liberals are evil" website.

The image and most of the article are meant to give you the impression that small children would be taught about consensual sex.
This is the same kneejerk reactionary misinformation about sex ed that has been repeated for years... Somehow implying that K-12 sex ed means that kindergarteners are being taught the same thing that seniors are taught.

High school sex ed consists of the how to, as well as education about STDs and contraception.
The Sex ed curriculum that is taught for small children is basically... Don't touch anyone's private area and if someone touches, or tries to touch, yours, tell a grown-up right away.

So I guess that could be considered part of the evil progressive agenda.
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  #84  
Old 29 December 2014, 22:45
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Originally Posted by Bravo Five Romeo View Post
This is the same kneejerk reactionary misinformation about sex ed that has been repeated for years... Somehow implying that K-12 sex ed means that kindergarteners are being taught the same thing that seniors are taught.
A. Do you have children?
B. Do you care about what they are taught in school?
C. Are there ANY subjects that you feel the school system has NO business teaching your child?

From the article (bolded for emphasis):

According to a list of three demands from students at University of California, Berkeley; University of California, Santa Barbara; and San Diego State University, the state of California should teach sexual consent to K-12 students.

K-12 means the grades Kindergarten (before 1st Grade) to 12 (High School senior). The article did not differentiate in any manner whatsoever.

Yes, it is surely a part of a Progressive agenda. Why I do not know. We have school systems saying that it is OK for little Johnnie to declare that he is a SHE. Then He/She can choose whatever restroom they choose. Don't believe me?
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  #85  
Old 29 December 2014, 22:49
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Go to the source. And, yes, there is a tremendous majority of parents upset about these Sex Education Core standards. Age appropriateness and government interference in a parental responsibility (make 96% suffer because of the irresponsible 4%) not being the least.

#1 is behavior modification. Unacceptable. Teachers are not qualified in this level of individualized psychological expertise, nor should they be. Schools do not have the right to outcome based education. It's has been proven to be both damaging (getting different moral standards from home) and ultimately unsuccessful to the desired manipulative outcome.

http://answer.rutgers.edu/file/natio...-standards.pdf

Last edited by TJ2JM1783; 29 December 2014 at 23:09.
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  #86  
Old 30 December 2014, 00:43
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  #87  
Old 30 December 2014, 01:45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SATCOM View Post
A. Do you have children?
B. Do you care about what they are taught in school?
C. Are there ANY subjects that you feel the school system has NO business teaching your child?
A.Yes
B.Yes
C.Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by SATCOM View Post
From the article (bolded for emphasis):

According to a list of three demands from students at University of California, Berkeley; University of California, Santa Barbara; and San Diego State University, the state of California should teach sexual consent to K-12 students.

K-12 means the grades Kindergarten (before 1st Grade) to 12 (High School senior). The article did not differentiate in any manner whatsoever.
Actually the article did differentiate clearly and it also misquoted (perhaps on purpose?) what the California college students demanded.
The exact quote was linked in the article and it was this (bolded for emphasis)...
"We recommend consent education in K12. College is too late for people to learn about bodily autonomy and respect."
"consent education"... NOT sexual consent... as the headline you quoted suggested.
In fact, the article that was linked went on to clarify...
"Consent is not just for intercourse. Its for all aspects of our lives, and people aren't understanding or being taught that," Warner said. Consent education also covers verbal harassment, healthy relationships -- romantic or otherwise -- and being aware of people's space.

"Concerned parents might think were talking about consent in purely sexual context, when really were talking on a day-to-day basis," Alejandra Melgoza, a Take Back the Night coordinator at UC Santa Barbara, told HuffPost. A major aspect of consent education is as simple as "keep your hands to yourself," she said.


So no... even if the California college students making this demand are a bunch of hyper sensitive PC douchebags.... they are NOT trying to teach small children about sex, regardless of what that misleading headline on that rightwing website is trying to imply.
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  #88  
Old 30 December 2014, 02:04
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  #89  
Old 30 December 2014, 06:13
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The problem with that statement is we're paying far too much for what are often part time prison facilities; with no vocational training, which would actually be useful to both society and student.

I was just listening to some sob story propaganda lies on the radio about some retired teacher on fixed income having to pinch pennies. The average IL teacher retirement income is over $72k/yr.

http://www.illinoispolicy.org/policy...s-in-illinois/

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  #90  
Old 30 December 2014, 06:46
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While I believe (sincerely) that due to pandering for votes and the lust for power there is truth to the idea of there being an agenda (and not just for progressives), I am with B5R -- I mean, how can anyone with any functioning brain mass not see the inaccuracies in the article above -- inaccuracies generated due to shitty writing and/or purposely misleading the readers?

The irony? The agenda of the author of the article is as dangerous (and obvious) as that of the so-called progressives....
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  #91  
Old 30 December 2014, 09:56
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Question

I am not going to lie and tell you that I went to the original link referenced in the story. If the story misquoted (in any manner) then that's patently wrong. We used to call the teachings mentioned in the article "Manners" back in the day. Are we (and the press, and those with agendas) now saying that modern parents are NOT teaching manners to their children. Those very subjects of politeness, respect, decency, personal space etc should be basic parenting 101. If said CA teachers are merely parroting/reinforcing societal norms with regard to those subjects in order to maintain order in the classroom, I am all for it. Why do we need to have a "class" on "consent"?

One of the reasons for the Manifesto (if you will) was clearly stated in their point #2: All Institutions of higher education must release not just sexual assault, domestic violence, and stalking reporting statistics; but full statistical data on investigation, adjudication, and sanction of these cases.

In point #3 they advise that learning about "bodily autonomy" at college age is too late. What is bodily autonomy? This is where B5R and SOTB got me going deeply into a rabbit hole of massive dimensions. I never heard the term (I am old) so I looked it up. The only clickable definition that is close is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodily_integrity

In reviewing the many web sites discussing body/bodily autonomy, it seems that the moniker is connected/associated with abortion rights and feminism. Lots of hand wringing on whether or not a fetus has "consent" etc. We (this forum) won't get into that, but a corollary question begs asking; do CA public schools need to teach K-12 about abortion rights? Or are they talking about the moral versus legal concept of body/bodily autonomy?

Here's some samples:

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/th...ion.453421159/
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rogereo...body-autonomy/
http://www.xojane.com/issues/abortio...ividual-choice
http://www.jimchines.com/2013/06/abo...dily-autonomy/
http://www.reddit.com/r/Feminism/com...ily_integrity/

In short; when K-12 is written (as it was in the original Take Back The Campus Demand) I immediately understand that is all grades, not just high school seniors.

http://www.macmillandictionary.com/u.../american/K-12
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  #92  
Old 30 December 2014, 11:41
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Who are they taking Berkeley back from? Their faculty's and administration's ideology is no different than it was in past decades. Their state funding comes from a legislature and governor who mostly agree with them in principle if not always in tactics. At the federal level they have a POTUS who agrees with them and actively uses executive branch agencies to further Berkeley's agenda nationwide and worldwide. In today's extra-constitutional arrangement of using the federal legislature as an advisory body with no real authority over the executive, with whom could the Berkeley protestors possibly be so frustrated? Old habits die hard, I guess.
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  #93  
Old 30 December 2014, 11:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SATCOM View Post
We used to call the teachings mentioned in the article "Manners" back in the day. Are we (and the press, and those with agendas) now saying that modern parents are NOT teaching manners to their children. Those very subjects of politeness, respect, decency, personal space etc should be basic parenting 101.
No. They aren't. Go to anywhere where people take their kids, their kids are mannerless little fucks who need to be thrown off cliffs. Parents coddle their children. "Manners" hurts their kids' feelings.

This is why the State has to teach "keep your hands to yourself" in school, because parents aren't doing it. If they discipline their kids then they won't be able to be best friends forever with their 3 year old.

There was a story of someone potty training their kid in the middle of a restaurant:

http://blog.sfgate.com/sfmoms/2012/0...parks-outrage/

Ever go to any store? Anywhere where kids congregate? They run all over the place, they bump into you, they don't say excuse me, etc.

So no, it's not Parenting 101 anymore. The State had to step in to teach basic manners because parents aren't doing it.

Quote:
. Why do we need to have a "class" on "consent"?
Because parents aren't teaching it.

Here are teens the day after Christmas:

http://www.wpxi.com/news/news/local/...l-brawl/njcM2/

My dad would have beaten my fucking ass for that.

I agree a lot of crap is hokey pokey fucking feel good nonsense. There are plenty of examples from Law students demanding that Professors not use the word "violate" as in "violate the Constitution" because it is a trigger word for potential rape victims, to people saying two 6 year olds kissing in the closet are somehow rapists and not simply like two 6 year olds doing what 6 year olds do, to people advocating that "male gaze" is akin to rape.

There's a bunch of stupid fucking shit out there, granted.

But as I look around at kids these days the parents aren't doing the work of parents. They just aren't. So to protect other kids the government has had to step in and teach basic shit like manners and not touching people when they don't want to be.
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  #94  
Old 30 December 2014, 12:45
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My dad would have beaten my fucking ass for that.
My Dad (Navy Vet) used to belt my brother and I on a regular basis. We always deserved it, always. Just recently was discussing some very funny memories with my daughter. Over the Holidays we viewed video from the 80s when she was a toddler. There was a shot of me and her shopping. I used to have a dog-leash-like device that I strapped to her waist and my belt loop. She could only get six feet away at any time. There was NO way she was going to run rampant around stores. There was NO way she was going to be kidnapped.....

I guess I'd probably go to jail for that today?

When all people cease to police themselves (and their children), government WILL step in and mete out proper etiquette. What's worse is when citizens attempt to "instruct" the young in societal norms, and THEY are criticized for their pro-bono advice.

Return the draft and corporal punishment immediately please.
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Old 30 December 2014, 13:03
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I am also guilty of the leash on a kid trick. I do it with my granddaughter now at the fair and get some nasty looks. Thank God I am in the south and I can still swat my kid when they get stupid.
There is no parenting or discipline, I have found that out coaching girl’s softball, the parents will not correct their kid but will correct you for correcting their kid. I have lost a few girls to hurt feelings, oh well.
My wife keeps feeding me this story that this is what the government wants where they will have an excuse to take the children and mold them to their perfect sheeple mold.
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  #96  
Old 30 December 2014, 22:45
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- Campus Reform is a project of the Leadership Institute, a organization dedicated to building the next generation of conservative leaders. It is generally known and accepted as truth that college campuses across the country, whether public or private, are centers of liberal thought. Bringing balance or a voice to the minority of students, who at times feel choked of free speech in the classroom - whether in a Women Studies class, a Hispanic Studies class, Religious Studies class, Political Science class, etc. - IMO is all good and rather an intriguing non classroom academic endeavor. Certainly, many Governors across the country are now appointing Presidents as chiefs of their state's universities who have more of a balanced approach in mind. Who can argue with that?

- The headline of the Campus Reform piece was misleading and intentionally provocative, no dispute. But it was no more misleading than any MSM headline on any given day from any given source. However, the substance of the article was truthful and correct. Additionally, both student activist leaders driving the consent education "referendum", Alejandra Melgoza and Meghan Warner, were asked for comment by Student Reform; they chose not to comment. I took a scroll through a variety of Student Reform articles and it seems to be an extension of their mission to ask for opposing comment. Generally, outside of debate teams, college student populations are not comfortable with civilized but heated discourse in an average classroom. Nor are they in general encouraged to disagree with teachers. Oh, the irony. I think putting the college population on notice that they have rights in the classroom and in society is perhaps more important than creation of the, who says its necessary but I am suppose to agree with your assertion about, "consent education". Am I really to believe "consent education" should and must be taught in the schools as a bone fide curriculum subject matter, given hours of classroom teaching time? Absurd in all its interpretations.

The students activists demanding inclusion of rigorous (Jell-O shot) curriculum on "consent education" were trying to be more clever than half. Consent education falls under the purview of sex education core standards. That is an absolute fact. While not all consent education is relative to any sexual connotation, I would wager over 75% is, and for leaders like Melgoza and Warner, they knew full well their consent education is over 90% directly related to sexual specific matters, but we're trying to make the discussion more general population palatable (not all which is intercourse, but nonetheless sexual in nature as in male or female issues). SO, the Campus Reform student retaliated in-kind, clever by half in its headline. However, seriously, analytically, who is more manipulative and disingenuous on mission? Personally, I find this free speech student debate on campuses across the country intriguing and highly entertaining.

- Having the state teach sex education is not necessary, and might be a complete violation of parental rights, but, for me, not offensive in any way until they teach age inappropriate "consent education", i.e. all matters of rape education, starting in 5th grade or by 11 years old. Which then begs the question should rape education be taught at all? 8th grade? 11th grade? And yes I am using a highly volatile subject intentionally because it is included in the government run education standards. At times what looks like a good standard or idea on a piece of paper turns out to be textbooks, literary novels, and informational texts that are highly sexualized in nature. For pre-pubescents and pubescents in urban failing schools neighborhoods, where the pregnancy rate and drop-out is through the roof, the geniuses in education reform decided let's deal with it by usurping parental authority and creating an all-powerful state/district directive that encompasses ALL students. Sufficed to say, it is not having the intended consequences. And, by extension, I am seriously concerned this gives teachers an "out" for not reporting suspicious student behaviors and evidence of abuse by putting the genesis and responsibility for reporting abuse on the victims shoulder. Before it was the adult who was fully responsible for reporting dysfunction in bodily fluids in a student, abuse marks - all manner of telling regarding child abuse. If this evolution of responsibility, whether we want to believe it or not, this is the subtext, continues effecting K12, I see more problems than solutions.

There is only one known mechanism for success in education (this is absolute for the majority of students): engaged parent, disciplined student, effective teacher. Anyone who thinks otherwise is factually wrong.

- Parents are engaged in their children's education all across the country - whether public or private. Just witness numerous open houses or parent teacher conferences at a variety of schools across different economic sectors. I will grant you this, the poor urban neighborhood school is in serious trouble. IMO the different curriculum hypotheses they have implemented in 100%, not just in urban schools, of the student body has not improved the situation. What has drastically improved student achievement in education has been parental school choice. The rise of charter schools in urban neighborhoods are and have been tremendously helpful, and it has been the parents that demanded it. Contrarily, the USDOE and individual state departments of education keep trying to restrict parents' participation in their child's education. Much is documented that it was the public educational institutions who started removing parental access - whether in observing in the classroom or being on a textbook selection committee or disagreement/discourse at the union sponsored PTA meeting - not the other way around. However, I can see where that narrative might be convenient for some. The state, along with the consent of education SMEs and parents, should be tasked to administer a program consistent with the aforementioned group consensus. That is the only power the state should have.

- I do not believe it is scientific to comment on the nature or behavior of children, when the commenter is probably exposed, or have a chance to interact, with them on an average of two or three times a week or less. If however, you are with them 100% in your work life, you have a better grasp of their behaviors. Best way to gauge student behaviors, or even adult behaviors, (academic aptitude analysis is exceedingly easy) is to ask them simple questions. If visiting a school ask a variety of students where the principal's office is or the audio visual room. Their responses and the manner of their responses will tell you the overall learning environment at a school. There are different cues to use at malls or movie theaters too.

My opinion is that kids are great. At the appropriate age they are adoring, jerks, disobedient, questioning, and/or individual thinkers. Most of learning is done outside of the classroom. After school is all done, the family remains. Removing parents from the learning and classroom environment is not only ineffective it is dangerous to overall civil society.

Children should be protected at all costs, where both schools and homes are their safe castles. I will not give in to the government on that, or give up on any student, even the behavioral problem child.

Sent from my very cool iPhone

Last edited by TJ2JM1783; 30 December 2014 at 22:52.
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  #97  
Old 26 January 2015, 00:05
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We were recently treated to a university offering fake classes to its athletes. Classes were supposedly attended, and they received passing grades. They did this because of the low reading-proficiency rates among black men at the University of North Carolina. Enter the new paradigm: Nobody fails school. Kind of reminds me of the military sometimes; troops can't make the standard---lower the standard.

http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/01/2...wer-60-percent

School District's New Grading Policy: No Scores Lower Than 60 Percent

A Tennessee school district has voted to set the minimum failing grade in its high schools at 60 percent, making it easier for students to pass.

Board members on the Monroe County Board of Education approved the new grading policy, which is meant to help students who are putting in effort, but struggling to raise their grades.

Whitney Neal and Dr. Michael Fiorillo appeared on "Fox and Friends Weekend" this morning to debate if this new policy just hurts students in the long run.

"You're letting kids know exactly that they have to do the bare minimum to achieve a passing grade and that's ridiculous," Neal said. "It doesn't teach them that there are consequences for failure and there are consequences for not producing hard work."

Fiorillo disagreed, pointing out that this should only affect the lower 7 to 10-percent of students.

"These are kids that are having a hard time and they're just going to drop out," he said, noting that 75 percent of the crimes committed in the U.S. are committed by high school dropouts.

"In my opinion, we have to try and graduate these kids. Not give them a free pass ... it's an opportunity to give them a second chance."
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  #98  
Old 26 January 2015, 00:35
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School District's New Grading Policy: No Scores Lower Than 60 Percent
Trust me, there is no progressive agenda in Monroe Country, TN. It's solidly red, even by Tennessee standards.

Something tells me the underlining motive for this is to do some voodo math with the numbers, so they don't loose funding. Tennessee has one of those No Child Left Behind waivers, and needs to show progress to the Feds to keep running things on their own.

Here's a local article for some more perspective on this. They say it's to keep more kids from dropping out.
http://www.local8now.com/home/headli...288779831.html
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  #99  
Old 26 January 2015, 00:57
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I believe you, but don't you find this quote to be telling from the link you posted:

"We're graduating people but are we educating them?"

I say yes, we are educating them. We are teaching them that even though they may suck, and be stupid as a rock, that the government will still make sure you succeed. Whether it be from a handout, or affirmative action, or a school with no failing students.

I need to watch that movie Idiocracy again..... wait here's a good quote from it:

Pvt. Joe Bowers: [addressing Congress] ... And there was a time in this country, a long time ago, when reading wasn't just for fags and neither was writing. People wrote books and movies, movies that had stories so you cared whose ass it was and why it was farting, and I believe that time can come again!
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Old 26 January 2015, 04:34
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When the USDOE was established under Johnson, the era of progressivism in education was introduced. Before then students learned more in one room school houses than they do today. FEDED is an absolute unconstitutional power grab on our rights. "The existence of a law does not create the constitutionality of that law. We operate under unconstitutional infringements all the time." Government telling us about schools and free speech and healthcare and guns "is not a constitutionally established right, it is an unconstitutionally established power".

Race to the Top is President Obama's reauthorization of No Child Left Behind; No Child Left Behind is President Bush's reauthorization of Johnson's landmark FEDED called the Elementary and Secondary Education Act. There are at least two other federal statutes, as well state constitutions and laws, that prohibit federal intrusion in education. But here we are. BIG GOVERNMENT IN EDUCATION leading American education on a continuous downward spiral. What can possibly go wrong with so many layers of bureaucracy and untimely process improvement?

Tennessee and Delaware were two of the first states that received RTTT funding. In Tennessee's case it was approximately $500 Million. To compare, Florida, the state that has 5 of the 12 largest school districts in the country, received approximately $700 Million.

The RTTT funds have waivers but they also has two major requirements - adoption of Common Core (Progressivism on steroids) and teacher accountability, of which graduation rates and state standardized assessments (for Tennessee it is called the Tennessee Comprehensive Assessment Program - TCAP) are a portion. I have no idea of Tennessee's legislative laws regarding education. But I do know the unions and teachers are highly concerned that graduation and assessments will be the sole criteria for accountability, educator retention, and pay increases. This move by the school district is not about the students, it's about the teachers. But if the school districts articulated the truth, mass protest. Tennessee has already received its RTTT funds. If they don't comply with the accountability requirements, I find it extremely hard to believe that the federal government has remedy to get the money back. I also find it hard to believe that if they graduate with a 60% they will be about to meet state or federal assessment minimums.

Nevertheless, I am not opposed with students graduating with a 60% IF there is another tie-in. 50% time in school with 50% time in job apprenticeship. I understand the challenges students face in urban poor neighborhoods and multi-lingual boroughs. I would never agree to leading a student to future employment failure. ALL these board members need to be fired or recalled (if elected). This looks more like a union pressure deal. IMO.

P.S. Regarding the national standards themselves, the Stanford Mathematics professor who wrote the equations that got our men to the moon, and who recognizes that we got to the moon with less technology than we have in our cellphones today, James Milgram, says they are garbage.
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