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  #21  
Old 29 May 2019, 19:46
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I saw this on the news and was wondering if you were involved.
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  #22  
Old 29 May 2019, 20:12
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Originally Posted by hawkdrver View Post
Similar for us. The transport companies are mostly aware of what they're carrying....mostly.

That's a whole different discussion though.

For anyone who's responded to a major commercial transportation mishap, I am wondering how rapidly first responders have access to their HAZMAT information. Pretty sure I know the answer.
Not as fast as they can access/analyze the placards. That's why they are required.
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  #23  
Old 29 May 2019, 20:40
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Originally Posted by hawkdrver View Post
Curious what effective capabilities you guys have as first responders to figure out what HAZ is on board. For trains, and everything else really.

I deal with a lot of HAZMAT, our system leads the industry but still leaves a lot to be desired IMO.
The conductor (and sometimes the engineer) is required to carry paperwork that details the supposed contents of each hazmat car and where it is located on train. This is in addition to supplemental hazmat reference material that details how to quickly find the info on the material and what the immediate evacuation distance is.This is an FRA reg. This is the obvious answer but the Best bet for 1st responders to make contact with train crew, if possible , and go from there. Other "sensitive" materials that are moved over rail will have someone monitoring/escorting nearby who will no doubt make contact with the responder. That's what I would do anyway..
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  #24  
Old 29 May 2019, 20:52
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There is a fantastic newer app called Ask Rail which will provide detailed information on the contents of rail cars when you plug in the reporting marks from the tank car. Its available from the app stores, but you have to get approval from the rails hazmat manager to get access. At the FD chief level you are able to get a copy of the consist from the app. As a hazmat tech, we extensively use WISER among others. The ERG gives good basic actions, but usually guides you to call CHEMTREC, and I've had very disappointing experiences from them in the past.

Great advice on the drones, the rails going through my area have them available, and when it comes to sizing an incident up are invaluable. I teach guys not to rely on the placards being there, especially in a derailment as they likely won't be there when everything lands.
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  #25  
Old 30 May 2019, 00:55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fat Guy View Post
Not as fast as they can access/analyze the placards. That's why they are required.
Pretty much what I figured.

Quote:
Originally Posted by revanation
The conductor (and sometimes the engineer) is required to carry paperwork that details the supposed contents of each hazmat car and where it is located on train.
Like I mentioned above, we do the same. Not knowledgable on the train industry, but for us the odds of us being around to hand that to the fire department are slim if there's a mishap significant enough to require it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by F18WUB
There is a fantastic newer app called Ask Rail which will provide detailed information on the contents of rail cars when you plug in the reporting marks from the tank car. Its available from the app stores, but you have to get approval from the rails hazmat manager to get access. At the FD chief level you are able to get a copy of the consist from the app. As a hazmat tech, we extensively use WISER among others. The ERG gives good basic actions, but usually guides you to call CHEMTREC, and I've had very disappointing experiences from them in the past.
Cool. Nothing like this exists on the aviation side that I'm aware of. Of course we are talking an order of magnitude smaller volume wise, and the ARFF guys generally roll ready for anything, but would be nice to have something like this available assuming the aircraft ends up off airport.

As usual apologies for the uh...talking off topic.
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  #26  
Old 30 May 2019, 06:49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F18Wub View Post
There is a fantastic newer app called Ask Rail which will provide detailed information on the contents of rail cars when you plug in the reporting marks from the tank car. Its available from the app stores, but you have to get approval from the rails hazmat manager to get access. At the FD chief level you are able to get a copy of the consist from the app. As a hazmat tech, we extensively use WISER among others. The ERG gives good basic actions, but usually guides you to call CHEMTREC, and I've had very disappointing experiences from them in the past.

Great advice on the drones, the rails going through my area have them available, and when it comes to sizing an incident up are invaluable. I teach guys not to rely on the placards being there, especially in a derailment as they likely won't be there when everything lands.
As you know, this type of crisis management is never inked in. Placards, manifests, hell even survivor statements can and have all been used to ID unknown materials. I developed an emergency response / evacuation plan for a major Texas Port and the stuff coming into non-regulated facilities was staggering. A facility with a USCG security plan is scrutinized for having Acetone because its on the radar. The Stevedore with 6 cars of chlorine gas slips through the track because there are no regulatory sensors on him and the USG commoditizes security programs.
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  #27  
Old 31 May 2019, 06:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fat Guy View Post

Bleve's are serious shit...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've heard that even a malfunctioning expansion tank on a home's gas fired boiler heating system - can seriously ruin your day - true? (I have one, LOL).
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On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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  #28  
Old 31 May 2019, 08:30
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It can it if becomes punctured or even exposed to high heat. They have a safety / blow out valve that relieves pressure as the liquid starts to boil even faster in the tank (Remember, it is always in a state of boiling, that's how you get the gas). When that valve blows, it releases pressure eventually the metal fails as it is no longer cooled by the liquid inside the tank and BANG.

Here is a utoob that explains it.

I have (had) a boiler in my house and it used vapor jets just like a furnace to make the flame and provide the heat. Liquid Propane should never ever leave your tank. (I have 2 of them as well)

The expansion tank on your boiler should only manage boiling water / water vapor. The big difference there being that the pressure may rupture the plumbing, but the vapor cannot burn or explode. It can however produce a dangerous projectile.
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Last edited by The Fat Guy; 31 May 2019 at 08:36.
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  #29  
Old 31 May 2019, 09:01
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Nice! Thx.
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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
On February 20, 2018, President Trump issued a memorandum instructing the Attorney General “to dedicate all available resources to… propose for notice and comment a rule banning all devices that turn legal weapons into machineguns.”

“I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man’s case that just took place in Florida ... to go to court would have taken a long time”

“Take the guns first, go through due process second”

"Or, Mike, take the firearms first, and then go to court"
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  #30  
Old 31 May 2019, 23:37
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCBqIleM8v8

One of our residents caught it on video..
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  #31  
Old 1 June 2019, 01:38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 256 View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCBqIleM8v8

One of our residents caught it on video..
Is that you in that door ass GruntStyle shirt??

A literal train derailment and the first thought is “let me stick around and film”.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=dVsxjKJDja4

This was in Texas and is usually shown in the “how to not be a blue canary” training.
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  #32  
Old 1 June 2019, 02:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitebean54 View Post
Is that you in that door ass GruntStyle shirt??

A literal train derailment and the first thought is “let me stick around and film”.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=dVsxjKJDja4

This was in Texas and is usually shown in the “how to not be a blue canary” training.
It’s my understanding it was a fixed security camera.
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  #33  
Old 1 June 2019, 04:57
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You guys were lucky in that the train wasn't carrying evil shit.

It's a wonder that there aren't more derailments, track/bed maintenance isn't where it should be.

I was an assistant signalman for Southern Pacific, between layoffs at the coal mines.

To the original poster, stay safe.
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