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  #81  
Old 17 April 2019, 09:10
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I'm going to have a hard time voting for someone that EO'd a piece of plastic, into a Machinegun, creating felons out of millions of otherwise law-abiding people. Right now my conscience is saying dealing with "it could be worse" is better than compromising 2A principles. We'll see in 19 months...
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  #82  
Old 17 April 2019, 09:15
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
I'm going to have a hard time voting for someone that EO'd a piece of plastic, into a Machinegun, creating felons out of millions of otherwise law-abiding people. Right now my conscience is saying dealing with "it could be worse" is better than compromising 2A principles. We'll see in 19 months...
agree. My candidate of choice will be the one that most aligns themselves with the BoR/ constitution. So far that's our current POTUS. And I don't see anyone on the left doing better in that regards.
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  #83  
Old 17 April 2019, 09:16
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
I'm going to have a hard time voting for someone that EO'd a piece of plastic, into a Machinegun, creating felons out of millions of otherwise law-abiding people. Right now my conscience is saying dealing with "it could be worse" is better than compromising 2A principles. We'll see in 19 months...
Unfortunately, ultimately, as seems the recent trend in elections we are continually forced with having to chose the lesser of two evils.
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  #84  
Old 17 April 2019, 10:04
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Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post
I hear what you are saying. Then well though that then see is what gets into of course of who's beliefs are right? Where as if there are no absolutes, no standard - then you have no standard at all and anything goes. For a society to function properly, there needs to be set standards. This is what keeps people in check, creates strong families, strong communities. Having social constricts on certain behaviours.

We fall into the trap of "your ok, I'm ok" progressive relativism where there ultimately is no right or wrong. We also have to be careful with who we make allies with, in terms of "the enemy of my enemy" is my friend, as sometimes that can come back and bite us in the ass as history has shown. Sometimes overlooking ideals, to compromise, does not end well in the long run.

Does this mean we outlaw gays and thrown them in jail? No. Do what you want in private. But when you start promoting it in public, having pride parades, teaching acceptance in elementary schools, forcing others to accept (and trying to ruin their business, livelihood if they don't), legally redefine the tradition of marriage and force all to facilitate, forcing the military to accommodate, or want to represent our nation/be our leader as you flaunt the homosexual lifestyle - that is where the objections are.
Right. Exactly. The communities around us dictate what is or is not acceptable. We may not like it and find ourselves the odd man out. That is on us. Our personal moral principles. It's a component of the law as well such as that dry county thing I mentioned. I may want to enjoy liquor each day, but the county says I cannot buy it to enjoy in their community. Personal vs. community standards represented in law.

Any segment of the community that wants to raise their moral-flag and wave it around also welcomes criticism. And by bringing attention to themselves sets a standard of behavior that may or may not be welcomed community wide. If I were gay I don't imagine myself wanting to bring attention to that fact. I imagine myself as an American wanting to assimilate into my America and be known as a good citizen. And be accepted as such. My sex life/proclivity isn't even a dinner table discussion presently much less something I'd join a parade about.

As for POTUS and his challengers. Ha. I await the troll in chief to do his thing.

Dems/MSM will do POTUS bidding destroying themselves as they've begun doing.
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  #85  
Old 20 April 2019, 09:38
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
I'm going to have a hard time voting for someone that EO'd a piece of plastic, into a Machinegun, creating felons out of millions of otherwise law-abiding people. Right now my conscience is saying dealing with "it could be worse" is better than compromising 2A principles. We'll see in 19 months...
Same for me. Once someone has done something to violate my rights, they are pretty much a no-go. No amount of good done for the economy or anything else can change that.
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  #86  
Old 20 April 2019, 09:52
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Same for me. Once someone has done something to violate my rights, they are pretty much a no-go. No amount of good done for the economy or anything else can change that.
So who would you vote for in 2020?
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  #87  
Old 20 April 2019, 10:39
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It will ALWAYS be choosing the lesser of two evils. My evil is not going to be 100% your evil. Representation is a compromise by its very nature. I won't like everything ANY candidate proposes, so it becomes who is closest to my thinking. I definitely know whom I have the most distaste for. Not voting for the closest to your individual preferences only guarantees you will be more dissatisfied with the result.
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  #88  
Old 20 April 2019, 11:24
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So who would you vote for in 2020?
As of right now Iím unsure.
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  #89  
Old 20 April 2019, 11:30
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Right now, the Ds are just floating ideas to gauge their popularity. The main players will adopt the stance of those that are and flatten the other candidates. Biden is "next in line" and, as such, would be a shoe-in if he wasn't old and white.
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  #90  
Old 20 April 2019, 11:50
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Originally Posted by HighDragLowSpeed View Post
Right now, the Ds are just floating ideas to gauge their popularity. The main players will adopt the stance of those that are and flatten the other candidates. Biden is "next in line" and, as such, would be a shoe-in if he wasn't old and white.
"You are only as young as the woman you feel"
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  #91  
Old 20 April 2019, 12:11
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Originally Posted by HighDragLowSpeed View Post
Biden is "next in line" and, as such, would be a shoe-in if he wasn't old and white.
Biden is done. The other Democrat candidates will hammer him into a messy paste with the #metoo mallet long before the primaries. As I've posted before, the one thing the Dems really need to defeat DJT in 2020 is the one thing they really don't have...unity.
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  #92  
Old 20 April 2019, 13:00
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Biden is done. The other Democrat candidates will hammer him into a messy paste with the #metoo mallet long before the primaries.
Biden has powerful friends, name recognition, and countless years in national level politics. He also had a front row seat to both Obama's and Clinton's machiavellian trickery. His #metoo moments are out there and will be old news by the time he announces. He may go down but not without a nasty fight.


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the one thing the Dems really need to defeat DJT in 2020 is the one thing they really don't have...unity.
I completely agree with you here.
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  #93  
Old 20 April 2019, 13:22
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Originally Posted by gavin View Post
Biden is done. The other Democrat candidates will hammer him into a messy paste with the #metoo mallet long before the primaries. As I've posted before, the one thing the Dems really need to defeat DJT in 2020 is the one thing they really don't have...unity.
Itís not like republicans are any more united.
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  #94  
Old 20 April 2019, 13:44
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Itís not like republicans are any more united.
This is a very specific sort of unity, and we donít yet know if the Republicans have it.

The true test of party unity will be if the RNC supports a GOP challenger in the primaries. The DNC is currently not doing anything to promote unity. If you want to see what perfect party unity looks like, study the DNC in 1991.
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  #95  
Old 20 April 2019, 17:58
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This is a very specific sort of unity, and we don’t yet know if the Republicans have it.

The true test of party unity will be if the RNC supports a GOP challenger in the primaries. The DNC is currently not doing anything to promote unity. If you want to see what perfect party unity looks like, study the DNC in 1991.
The RNC isn't just on the Trump Train, they're part of the train already...that it's Mitt Romney's niece at the head of the RNC as they've gotten to this point is a funny aside. The only "support" a challenger will have is getting their name on a primary ballot if they qualify by state rules, the RNC has clearly hitched itself to the President.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...-ahead-of-2020

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...20-rnc-1197115

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/28/polit...ary/index.html
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  #96  
Old 20 April 2019, 18:05
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As of right now Iím unsure.
Fair enough. I intend to support the POTUS, as I don't see any better candidate out there.

I don't believe in giving my vote to a candidate that doesn't have a chance. I got burned voting for Perot in '92; I won't make that mistake again.
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  #97  
Old 20 April 2019, 19:37
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Originally Posted by Gray Rhyno View Post
Fair enough. I intend to support the POTUS, as I don't see any better candidate out there.

I don't believe in giving my vote to a candidate that doesn't have a chance. I got burned voting for Perot in '92; I won't make that mistake again.
1989 Assault Weapons Ban... 1994 Assault Weapons Ban... meh. I'll vote the balloted Libertarian, write in Johnson or one of the "Pauls", or stay home. I may not get my way, but I'll do my best to make sure he doesn't either.

Now he's going to the "Red Flag" supporting Fudd Central (NRA) to give a speech - I'm trying to keep my stomach contents down. Fool me once...
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  #98  
Old 20 April 2019, 22:43
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Originally Posted by Gray Rhyno View Post
Fair enough. I intend to support the POTUS, as I don't see any better candidate out there.

I don't believe in giving my vote to a candidate that doesn't have a chance. I got burned voting for Perot in '92; I won't make that mistake again.
Those candidates would have a chance if people would cast their votes for them. Instead, people keep voting for the same people, then bitching about the direction they are taking the country.
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  #99  
Old 21 April 2019, 13:58
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Those candidates would have a chance if people would cast their votes for them. Instead, people keep voting for the same people, then bitching about the direction they are taking the country.
I agree, and until they can build that level of support, votes for them might as well be votes for whomever you oppose. Lots of evidence out there suggesting that had Perot not run as an independent Papa Bush would have been reelected president in 1992. All of us who voted for Perot just increased the value of the votes cast for WJC.
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  #100  
Old 21 April 2019, 15:58
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Originally Posted by Gray Rhyno View Post
I agree, and until they can build that level of support, votes for them might as well be votes for whomever you oppose. Lots of evidence out there suggesting that had Perot not run as an independent Papa Bush would have been reelected president in 1992. All of us who voted for Perot just increased the value of the votes cast for WJC.
...and you think a second term of Bush 1 would have netted a different result than Clinton?

Until the make up of Congress changes the best you can hope for us a disruptive POTUS, like DJT, to gain a little breathing space.

That's all DJT is, and folks should get this fact squarely in the front of their thinking AND planning...

POTUS may pull.out a second term, I hope so - not because I think he's going to effect substantial change, but for two reasons :

1. SCOTUS

2. Breathing space...


I think, at this point, SCOTUS is only a breathing space institution - the powers that be in Congress can make them irrelevant when they choose.

...my .02, ymmv...
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